ext-296 Day 5 | Masons vs Illuminati Werewolf Game

Replay

You are viewing day 5 of a game of werewolv.es started on the 18-Nov-04 Sun on a 24 hour cycle (12h day, 12h night).

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Simon Thu 09:00

No revives :(
Operative Thu 09:00

God dammit, wassup team
Simon Thu 09:00

nobody expected me to be alive that's for sure
Thu 09:01

Guess we wait for reports
JubalEarly Thu 09:01

welp
Monty Thu 09:01

Hello
Simon Thu 09:01

I hope River checked Saffron
Monty Thu 09:01

I'm Militia. I was waiting to use my shot in the previous night with patience. But, last night I lost my patience and shot Patience because he seems to lurk around. ^^
Thu 09:02

That too many dead tho.
Simon Thu 09:02

Hmmmm okay Monty
Higgins Thu 09:02

i blame Jayne for Inara death, it's highly that he was redirected to Inara
Monty Thu 09:02

Erk.
Higgins Thu 09:02

Jayne, you did not stay at home, right?
Operative Thu 09:03

What's your check higg
Tracey Thu 09:03

Good morning
Thu 09:03

well, bad morning really
Higgins Thu 09:03

Operative, i checked you
Monty Thu 09:03

There always good in bad thing.
JubalEarly Thu 09:03

what about the masonssss
Higgins Thu 09:03

you seemed sus
Thu 09:03

but you aren't sus
Thu 09:03

that is disappoint
Operative Thu 09:03

Nice
Fess Thu 09:04

Wassup ladies and gents
Monty Thu 09:04

Wassup
Fess Thu 09:04

Wash is also Faithful
Higgins Thu 09:04

none of the mason claim died so i think they successful recruited someone
JubalEarly Thu 09:04

or just aren't lit :.
Fanty Thu 09:04

Hey hey, killed Mingo, lurkers are maplefood
Operative Thu 09:04

Surprised it wasn't you higg
Thu 09:04

That got recruited
Fess Thu 09:05

Who was your other kill, Fanty?
SheriffBourne Thu 09:05

Heya
Higgins Thu 09:05

nah, if i got recruited, i will have wall of text for them
Thu 09:05

hey Sheriff
River Thu 09:05

Good news guys
Higgins Thu 09:05

who did you try to recruit?
SheriffBourne Thu 09:05

quite the amount of kills
Thu 09:05

I have made a succesful recruit
Fanty Thu 09:05

I've killed two lurkers now: Mingo last night and Atherton the previous night
SheriffBourne Thu 09:05

that's all I say
Thu 09:05

they're still alive today
Thu 09:05

Also
Thu 09:05

Niska and I have met each other in the night
River Thu 09:05

I actually got Rivers of babylon out of my head
Thu 09:05

it's cheepers creepers time!
Thu 09:06

Saffron was fam :)
Fess Thu 09:06

Oyeh
Higgins Thu 09:06

i think this is time for FULL ROLE CLAIM
Fess Thu 09:06

Another fam
Higgins Thu 09:06

this can't be 295 again
SheriffBourne Thu 09:06

So I think we understand the game
Thu 09:06

multiple vamp basements, multiple subfactions
Higgins Thu 09:06

EVERYONE CLAIM, I DON'T WANT THIS WILL BE 295 AGAIN
SheriffBourne Thu 09:06

I don't think the Illuminati necessarily exists, but at least there's room for a vamp basement to claim it.
Tracey Thu 09:07

*sigh*
Thu 09:07

Feeling like this will be 295
SheriffBourne Thu 09:07

Hey, Tracey. Want to claim?
Tracey Thu 09:07

Again
Thu 09:08

Not yet
Moderator Thu 09:08

Fess votes to lynch Mal
Moderator Thu 09:08

Simon votes to lynch Tracey
Moderator Thu 09:08

SheriffBourne votes to lynch Tracey
Fess Thu 09:08

Asv on a main character
Moderator Thu 09:08

Operative votes to lynch Zoe
Higgins Thu 09:08

WE WON'T ACCEPT "CLAIM DAY ISN'T A THING"
Moderator Thu 09:08

Higgins votes to lynch Tracey
Simon Thu 09:08

Kinda with Higg on this
Tracey Thu 09:08

When I said not yet I meant I can't do it right now but will in like an hour
Thu 09:08

as i have to go
SheriffBourne Thu 09:08

Higgins actually makes sense today! =)
Simon Thu 09:09

Higg, what was operative?
SheriffBourne Thu 09:09

Okay, Tracey.
Tracey Thu 09:09

so i'll be back around 10
Fess Thu 09:09

Higgins going strong. Rawr.
River Thu 09:09

Higgins got shifted, I agree with him
Fess Thu 09:09

:p
Higgins Thu 09:09

Operative isn't evil
Operative Thu 09:09

Huzzah
Higgins Thu 09:09

that is disappoint
Simon Thu 09:09

Op, your claim?
Operative Thu 09:09

I'm good
Thu 09:09

Thanjs
Higgins Thu 09:09

ok, what kind of good role?
SheriffBourne Thu 09:09

Does it help us if you claim, Op?
Higgins Thu 09:10

did you maybe be recruited by vamp last night?
Operative Thu 09:10

Well I've been checked as both village and none wc. Work it out
Fess Thu 09:10

Wait, we got 1 maple... 3 vamps?
Operative Thu 09:10

It doesn't help if I claim now
Stitch Thu 09:10

morning
SheriffBourne Thu 09:10

Alright, then we can drop Op for the moment, right?
Thu 09:10

Hey Stitch
Higgins Thu 09:10

fam role or non fam role?
Thu 09:10

@Operative
Operative Thu 09:10

Move on I'm not claiming
Thu 09:10

So stitch what did you see?
Higgins Thu 09:10

you don't have to claim your exact role
Thu 09:11

just tell us you are fam or non fam
Operative Thu 09:11

Why do I need to narrow it down?
Simon Thu 09:11

Op is good for now
Stitch Thu 09:11

lenore was indeed a stalker
Higgins Thu 09:11

so at least we can know you can be recuited by vamp or not
Fess Thu 09:11

Cool. Perhaps a 1-time role.
Simon Thu 09:11

Moving on
Higgins Thu 09:11

you are good for now but still can be recuited by vamp
Simon Thu 09:11

Keep going Stitch
Fess Thu 09:12

We want all of em
Moderator Thu 09:12

Fanty votes to lynch Nandi
Higgins Thu 09:12

Operative was checked as non wc and non evil, perfect recruit for vamp
Stitch Thu 09:12

well someone visited someone last night
SheriffBourne Thu 09:12

What did Lenore see? Or at least who did she follow, in case the visit is soemthing you don't want to share atm?
Fanty Thu 09:12

Voting our final lurker for now.
SheriffBourne Thu 09:12

"someone visited someone"
Stitch Thu 09:12

tracey visited someone
Fanty Thu 09:12

And that someone was...
Fess Thu 09:12

Someun
Stitch Thu 09:12

i won't say who yet
Simon Thu 09:12

Okay
SheriffBourne Thu 09:13

Mmz
Fess Thu 09:13

But u just said it
Stitch Thu 09:13

fuk it
SheriffBourne Thu 09:13

Perhaps you should've let Tracey claim first, she was set under pressure anyway
Stitch Thu 09:13

she visited mr sheriff
Higgins Thu 09:13

still want Operative claim, i have a feeling he is fam role
Fanty Thu 09:13

Can I ask why the militia felt the need to kill a lurker and use their ability??
SheriffBourne Thu 09:13

Higgins - drop it? Your Seer check should be valuable enough?
Fanty Thu 09:14

I know we have refreshes weekly but still, seems a waste
SheriffBourne Thu 09:14

Tracey visiting me is really interesting, and adds to vamp paranoia.
Thu 09:14

We'll sort that out. I also have to leave, I'll try to drop by when Tracey starts talking.
Moderator Thu 09:15

Simon votes to lynch DrCaron
Simon Thu 09:15

Drunk Check time
Higgins Thu 09:16

i want every single one here claim so Operative pls claim today or just tell us you are fam role or non fam role so we can keep an eye on you in case of you are recruited by vamp
Simon Thu 09:20

Higg care to write up a claim list for us?
Moderator Thu 09:22

Operative votes to lynch MrUniverse
Operative Thu 09:22

Not happy with the militia who shot, was that Monty?
Moderator Thu 09:22

Operative votes to lynch Monty
Simon Thu 09:26

Why not?
Stitch Thu 09:29

why waste it?
Operative Thu 09:33

He didn't have to use it before patience even got a chance to claim something
Thu 09:34

Also militia is a fam role so
Higgins Thu 09:39

Operative, seems like you are interested in fam role. Are you fam role? Just asking :)
Simon Thu 09:40

Higgins: Drop. It.
Thu 09:41

Stitch what have you got tonight? Do I get my GD back?
Higgins Thu 09:44

Claim list: DrCaron / drunk (hasn't sobered up); MrU / militia (hasn't shoted before yesterday); Monty / militia (shoted Patience last night); Fanty / mw, Fess / inquisitor; Simon / inq leader; River / gd; Sheriff / ml (was drunk); Niska / vanila who is part of mason will turn into ml when ml die (was drunk); Jayne / wh; Stitch / gv
Thu 09:45

oh wait, i forgot myself
Monty Thu 09:45

GV should said what he get. Incase redirect
Higgins Thu 09:45

Higgins / seer (was drunk)
Thu 09:46

we have 20 people left and more than half of them already claimed so i don't think why people should fear to claim LIKE 295
Simon Thu 09:46

Monty I believe Op wants to know why you shot
Higgins Thu 09:47

he said it earlier
Thu 09:47

<Monty> Thu 09:01 I was waiting to use my shot in the previous night with patience. But, last night I lost my patience and shot Patience because he seems to lurk around. ^^
Moderator Thu 09:49

Higgins votes to lynch Mal
Higgins Thu 09:49

Tracey will claim later so i will start with Mal
River Thu 09:50

what did wash claim?
Higgins Thu 09:50

he claimed?
Moderator Thu 09:50

River votes to lynch Wash
Simon Thu 09:52

Knowing if Jayne was redirected will tell us a lot about the set up
Monty Thu 09:52

Why would I safe my shot for one more night? I might get kill without even use them if I keep on save it for later.
Stitch Thu 09:52

im beholder again
River Thu 09:53

I wanna pressure wash, his talk the last few days was mildly infuriating to me
Stitch Thu 09:53

as always
Thu 09:53

3 days in a row now
Higgins Thu 09:53

which is sus :)
Monty Thu 09:53

Did you give your check last night before the one you behold?
Stitch Thu 09:53

huh?
River Thu 09:53

he did
Thu 09:53

he said shepered was fam right?
Monty Thu 09:53

Cool.
Stitch Thu 09:53

lawrence saw sheperd as fam
Thu 09:54

lenore saw tracey visit sheriff
Monty Thu 09:54

That yesterday
Thu 09:54

Ok cool
River Thu 09:54

am I the only one sus of wash?
Simon Thu 09:54

No
Thu 09:55

Nandi is similarly sus
Higgins Thu 09:55

well, the only way i can trust gv claim is they can provide us a revive :)
River Thu 09:55

i want some actual claim and contribution to this game, the whole fking setup talk was kinda useless
Higgins Thu 09:55

don't forget Zoe
River Thu 09:55

well we'll eat/lynch the lurkers anyway
Thu 09:55

that's why I wanna know what wash is
Monty Thu 09:55

Revived could come from Witch too ^^
Higgins Thu 09:56

it depend on who he revive and that person is different than before or not :)
Thu 09:56

but if he revie KAylee then we don't know much :)
Stitch Thu 09:57

i was reviver for n2
Simon Thu 09:57

Lawrence revive please as I get my inquiry at full capacity
Monty Thu 09:57

Hn. True true.
Thu 09:57

Simon. If you push it too much. They won't do it for ya.
River Thu 09:57

lawrence would be the optimal one, we got uhm "data" on him
Simon Thu 09:58

Plus we will know if they have been swapped
Higgins Thu 09:58

but again Kaylee was ml so revive her still good for us and Sheriff, Niska can confirm her and she can tell us who did she tried to recruit
Simon Thu 09:58

But Lawrence could tell us that and help check the GY rather than die to a bad recruit
Monty Thu 09:59

You just selfishly want your full team.
Higgins Thu 09:59

she can die again but Sheriff and Niska can alive and tell us who she try to recruit
Monty Thu 09:59

I like the idea of revived ML again.
Simon Thu 10:00

No, I want the optimal revive for us all
Monty Thu 10:00

It verify the current ML too at the same time
Higgins Thu 10:00

plus, ml has a successful recruit last night
Thu 10:00

and that person is alive
Monty Thu 10:00

If the Drunk is really turn to ML.
River Thu 10:00

I'm pretty sure this is a basement battle by now
Monty Thu 10:00

I thought we not really convinces about that?.
Thu 10:01

What us basement battle?
River Thu 10:01

the subfactions are there to sniff out all the recruits
Thu 10:01

Vampires fighting each other
JubalEarly Thu 10:01

Inara felt like she was recruited by illuminati
Monty Thu 10:01

Pffft.
JubalEarly Thu 10:01

but no other evidence that they exist
River Thu 10:01

I don't think there's any Coven/UD
Simon Thu 10:01

Hey Jubal. Claim please
Higgins Thu 10:01

oh hi Jubal
Operative Thu 10:01

I want prot back. Surely stopping kills is better than a ML with almost everyone in the game recruited at this point
River Thu 10:02

this game is full of stalkers, gd's, subfactions and killing roles
JubalEarly Thu 10:02

got nothing of value but its worth claiming I guess
Thu 10:02

Harlot (checks coming)
Monty Thu 10:02

Revived the ML in gy. That way can verify more peeps.
Higgins Thu 10:02

revive ml pls
Monty Thu 10:02

Oof.
River Thu 10:02

if my setup suspicion is right, probably no revives
Monty Thu 10:02

Why not?
Higgins Thu 10:02

then we lynch Stitch :)
Monty Thu 10:02

GV is random role.
JubalEarly Thu 10:02

N1 - Inara visited by bester N2 - Niska visited by no one. N3 - Inara visited by Jayne, Inara visited by Inara N4 - Higgins visited by Inara
Monty Thu 10:02

Should be, always be.
River Thu 10:03

we got 2 visits on jayne now
Thu 10:03

jayne visiting Inara and Sheriff
Thu 10:03

wait no
Thu 10:03

that was tracey
Thu 10:03

nvm
JubalEarly Thu 10:03

I thought Tracey
Thu 10:03

did she claim btw?
Monty Thu 10:03

O.o
River Thu 10:03

^
JubalEarly Thu 10:03

I forgot
Higgins Thu 10:03

oh, thank you Inara for protected me :)
River Thu 10:03

Idiot
Thu 10:03

why would anyone protect you^^
Monty Thu 10:03

Inara ded.
River Thu 10:03

:D
JubalEarly Thu 10:04

shoulda visited Jayne last night :/
Thu 10:04

was worried about suc but thought they'd play it careful
Thu 10:04

but I guess they just went for it properly
Higgins Thu 10:04

i thought she would protected herself because they said the plan out loud yesterday so evil would know and try to kill her
JubalEarly Thu 10:04

probably*
Thu 10:04

well she protted herself the previous night
River Thu 10:04

well the good thing is, she got murdered in her sleep, so inquisition doesn't have to burn her on a stake
Thu 10:05

less painfull probably
Thu 10:05

RIGHT?
Monty Thu 10:05

Pffft
JubalEarly Thu 10:05

probably won't be as active today until later tonight
Thu 10:05

but will try to stop by here and there
Simon Thu 10:06

River have you thought about joining the inquisition?
River Thu 10:06

What ya think of my basement battle?
JubalEarly Thu 10:06

what do we think about Tracey visiting Sheriff?
Simon Thu 10:06

HM?
River Thu 10:06

Now that I can't see inara burn, my interest is severely diminished. Sorry
JubalEarly Thu 10:06

seems reasonable
Simon Thu 10:06

Fair enough
River Thu 10:06

No, all should visit me
Simon Thu 10:06

Also Seer
Thu 10:07

Didn't have time to type checks
River Thu 10:07

Dunno, feeling tells me someone gonna come up with a fake basement shit
Thu 10:07

and claim ILLU or something
Thu 10:07

game kinda invites such plans
Simon Thu 10:07

Could just be a non-lethal vamp/fam
JubalEarly Thu 10:07

Inara seemed to be hinting Illu pretty hard but that just may have been her normal way of going about things
River Thu 10:07

so today I'm more sceptical about the masons
Thu 10:08

also higgins wanting to revive the ML
JubalEarly Thu 10:08

I'm curious about Sheriff's recruit
Thu 10:08

not saying he needs to reveal
Thu 10:08

but could help with lit-ness
River Thu 10:08

he needs to
Tracey Thu 10:08

Well I know who he recruited
River Thu 10:08

if we go full subfactions the subfactions should claim
JubalEarly Thu 10:08

(vamp recruits too of course but still)
Tracey Thu 10:08

Hi again by the way
Thu 10:08

as I stalked him last night
JubalEarly Thu 10:08

cause Tracey is stalker? :O
Thu 10:08

so many stalkers
River Thu 10:08

too many stalkers
JubalEarly Thu 10:09

recruits
River Thu 10:09

I TELL YOU THIS IS BASEMENT BATTLE
Thu 10:09

recruits should be open
JubalEarly Thu 10:09

ok gtg for a bit
River Thu 10:09

I call shit on at least one subfaction
Higgins Thu 10:09

i open for recruit by anyone, except inq :)
Simon Thu 10:09

Tracey, spill
Thu 10:09

Spill all
Tracey Thu 10:09

Is it wise for me to say who he recruited?
Simon Thu 10:09

Yes
Tracey Thu 10:10

Well he visited Fanty
River Thu 10:10

Sorry but I have to say YES as well, Masons were messy yesterday
Thu 10:10

I don't fully trust them
Simon Thu 10:10

All checks please
Tracey Thu 10:10

okay so in the light of what was just said about "i bet someone is about to claim illu"
Thu 10:11

I am illuminati
Thu 10:11

we exist
Higgins Thu 10:11

opps
Tracey Thu 10:11

we have a strong team
JubalEarly Thu 10:11

was inara part of it?
Tracey Thu 10:11

I am not going to speculate who is in and who isnt
Simon Thu 10:11

You're going to tell us every member
Tracey Thu 10:11

No I'm not
Moderator Thu 10:11

River votes to lynch Tracey
Moderator Thu 10:11

Higgins votes to lynch Tracey
Higgins Thu 10:11

opps
River Thu 10:12

oops
Tracey Thu 10:12

I do however have some juicy information about a known vamp
Thu 10:12

we know a vamp, almost 100%
River Thu 10:12

aha
Simon Thu 10:13

Full info dump now. All your checks please and how you know a vamp
Higgins Thu 10:13

is that vamp your leader? :)
River Thu 10:13

WHY WOULD A VILLAGE FACTION HINT ABOUT A VAMP?
Thu 10:13

common guys
Tracey Thu 10:13

Well the problem we have here is that it's in our interests to kill masons
River Thu 10:13

if you got a vamp, you fucking say it
Tracey Thu 10:13

no because yesterday i would have prefered we lynch a mason
River Thu 10:13

I win with all of them, so let's just lynch you.
Higgins Thu 10:13

are you going to say it's Sheriff? :)
Tracey Thu 10:14

I dont know what sherrif is, i only know his visit last night
River Thu 10:14

Yo Tracillus, if you want to start some turf war with 20 players left, go f yourself.
Tracey Thu 10:14

this is what this game is though
Operative Thu 10:14

Factions work in their own interests
Tracey Thu 10:14

there are multiple village factions with their own win conditions
Operative Thu 10:15

If you don't then they all might aswell be masons
Simon Thu 10:15

Tracey you need to tell us all of your information now
Tracey Thu 10:15

Yeha I'm not going to do that
Operative Thu 10:15

I don't think he does
Simon Thu 10:15

So operative is illuminati too then
Higgins Thu 10:15

https://media1.tenor.com/images/1742d2899ac2d797d88bd70a8e048587/tenor.gif
River Thu 10:15

there are also dudes killing you
Moderator Thu 10:16

Simon votes to lynch Tracey
River Thu 10:16

I SAY WE ELIMINATE THE ILLU, THEY HAVE NO INTEREST IN WORKING WITH US ANYWAY
Operative Thu 10:16

If masons are alive illuminati lose
River Thu 10:16

your problem
Tracey Thu 10:16

we do have an interest in working with you
Operative Thu 10:16

So kill us. Guess we won't tell you the two vamps we found
Tracey Thu 10:16

and we have a strong team
Thu 10:16

which is good at finding vamps
Simon Thu 10:16

So tell us the sodding vamp and all your checks
Tracey Thu 10:16

no because you'll kill the vamp and not the masons
Operative Thu 10:16

Why would we do that when you're voting to lynch one of us
Simon Thu 10:16

It's now 2!?
Higgins Thu 10:16

i think mason would love to kill illu, maybe mw can kill you for them :)
Tracey Thu 10:17

as i said, we have a strong team
Higgins Thu 10:17

mason can kill your team :)
River Thu 10:17

@traceys idgaf
Higgins Thu 10:17

can you kill mason? :)
Operative Thu 10:17

Guess we have no reason to help then
River Thu 10:17

we got a lynch target for the day guys
Tracey Thu 10:17

Okay well i guess these two vamps die with me then
Thu 10:18

GL
Simon Thu 10:18

Masons can die at night vamps can't...
Operative Thu 10:18

Tbh if those guys are masons then illu got screwed and I don't really care to help so
Tracey Thu 10:18

yeah that is IF they are masons... we dont know
Operative Thu 10:18

Especially if you're happy to lynch a member of the village so
Higgins Thu 10:18

https://media1.tenor.com/images/1742d2899ac2d797d88bd70a8e048587/tenor.gif
Tracey Thu 10:18

all i know is who sherrif visited
Thu 10:18

could still all be bullshit
Higgins Thu 10:18

yea, said by illu
Operative Thu 10:18

Yeah trying to strong arm illu by lynching us isn't gonna make us want to help
River Thu 10:19

good bye tracey
Thu 10:19

VOTES TO TRACEY
Tracey Thu 10:19

okay bye
Operative Thu 10:19

Lol, suicidal village
Thu 10:19

Enjoy finding the vamps with no prot
Simon Thu 10:19

You realise we will quite happily move to lynch a vamp if you just tell us who they are?
Tracey Thu 10:19

I would rather we lynch a mason
Operative Thu 10:20

Lol
River Thu 10:20

f off tracey
Thu 10:20

just shut it and go
Tracey Thu 10:20

or how about we lynch the person who made up a role
River Thu 10:20

you're pissing me off to no end
Operative Thu 10:20

You shouldn't be voting for a known villager whether they are giving info or not
River Thu 10:20

just f off
Tracey Thu 10:20

you know "oh guys the mod just made a role"
Operative Thu 10:20

Killing villagers because they are working in their own interested
Tracey Thu 10:20

"and gave it to me"
Operative Thu 10:20

So dumb
River Thu 10:20

nobody gives a shit tracy
Tracey Thu 10:20

how about we kill that guy
Thu 10:20

no river you dont but you seem angry so thats fine
Thu 10:20

I'll just ignore you
River Thu 10:20

can we get some more votes?
Operative Thu 10:21

Sure kill a villager instead of an evil
Thu 10:21

Seems reasonable river
Higgins Thu 10:21

you know, i think i could have sobered up to insane seer and Operative sould be evil :)
Operative Thu 10:21

Lol
River Thu 10:21

you know who is not reasonable?
Thu 10:21

you
Tracey Thu 10:21

You all need to realise what this setup is - multi-faction village setup where we have our own win conditions
Simon Thu 10:21

Stalker is a fam role. We could be diminishing a vamp crew. I'm okay with that.
Tracey Thu 10:21

we want village to win
Operative Thu 10:21

Why would we help you if you're voting to kill us
Tracey Thu 10:21

but we need other things to happen
Thu 10:21

otherwise WE DONT WIN
River Thu 10:21

20 players
Tracey Thu 10:21

so why would we not do that
Operative Thu 10:21

I've been checked as village and am saying he is on my team
River Thu 10:22

you're fighting over the corpse before it's dead
Operative Thu 10:22

How is he a fan
Tracey Thu 10:22

yes it's unfortunate that we had to come out at this point
Simon Thu 10:22

You know how you also don't win? If vamps do...
Tracey Thu 10:22

yes i agree
River Thu 10:22

btw. you're making no sense
Thu 10:22

so I think you're full of bs
Thu 10:22

here's the deal:
Tracey Thu 10:22

so let's kill this guy that said he was some kind of new mason role
Operative Thu 10:22

WE ARENT MASOBS
River Thu 10:22

1) you say you are illu and want masons dead
Tracey Thu 10:22

then tomorrow I'll tell you one of the vamps
Operative Thu 10:22

Inq shouldn't be acting like masons
River Thu 10:22

2) you say masons are not real
Thu 10:23

So if you guys actually thought masons were not lit, you'd have no SPECIAL interest to kill them
Operative Thu 10:23

From our perspective masons have a MW, we are screwed
River Thu 10:23

hey operative
Operative Thu 10:23

Why would we help if the balance isn't fixed a bit?
River Thu 10:23

your buddy just said masons are fake
Tracey Thu 10:23

We want ot kill them in case they are telling the truth
River Thu 10:23

can you two actually agree on a plan?
Thu 10:23

you're pathetic
Operative Thu 10:23

Lol
Thu 10:24

Anyone saying they are a mason real or fake is not an ally of ours
Tracey Thu 10:24

I am skeptical about this "new role" but I would rather not take the chance of there being ANOTHER ML after this ML dies
Operative Thu 10:24

You guys never played a game with conflicting interests jeeze
Tracey Thu 10:24

so yes, I would like that person to die
Simon Thu 10:24

So you get lynched today and the MW eats op tonight. You don't win that way
Tracey Thu 10:24

we have no other choice
River Thu 10:24

well played
Operative Thu 10:24

We don't win anyway if masons are alive
River Thu 10:24

lol
Higgins Thu 10:24

i think this is why 3 drunks had to turned into villagers because this village has some bs here :)
River Thu 10:24

it's 20 people
Operative Thu 10:24

They are gonna have 5 members by Friday then refresh
River Thu 10:24

god gracious
Thu 10:25

20 PEOPLE
Thu 10:25

and you think masons will win
Thu 10:25

that's so funny
Higgins Thu 10:25

only single use ability get recharged
Operative Thu 10:25

Masons ALL have to die for us to win
Tracey Thu 10:25

there is a ML in the graveyard, ML alive now who has already recuited and a BAKCUP ML (if he is telling the truth)
Thu 10:25

so you can see our concern
River Thu 10:25

no.
Higgins Thu 10:25

i don't see anything
Operative Thu 10:25

No recruit does too
River Thu 10:26

as someone not involved in faction shenanigans and just wants village to win, NO.
Operative Thu 10:26

Lol
Tracey Thu 10:26

My proposal is we kill Niska today and we reveal one vamp tomorrow
Higgins Thu 10:26

me too
Tracey Thu 10:26

plain village is a faction
Thu 10:26

in itself
Operative Thu 10:26

These people thinking all sub factions should act like masons is making me LOL
Tracey Thu 10:27

yeah i dont understand how you are not getting this
Operative Thu 10:27

Like masons and vamps need to die for us to win
Tracey Thu 10:27

we are only semi on your side
Operative Thu 10:27

It's actually funny
Tracey Thu 10:27

we can help you win the game as town
Thu 10:27

but we arent going to do that above winning ourselves
Thu 10:27

if we don't win, then why would we help you
Operative Thu 10:27

Exactly. Otherwise what's the point of factions
Tracey Thu 10:28

plain town and illu and inq can all win
Thu 10:28

but we have to be against the masons
River Thu 10:28

I wont move my vote.
Higgins Thu 10:28

let's just kill them and revive ml so we will have a strong ml team
Thu 10:28

this is why we love mason more than other sub-faction
Operative Thu 10:28

We can have one mason left actually
Thu 10:28

Just checked
Tracey Thu 10:28

OKay well likei said we have two vamps already so good luck
Operative Thu 10:28

Ok, well I guess we'll just keep the vamp info then
Tracey Thu 10:29

My proposal is this
Thu 10:29

Today we kill Niska
Fanty Thu 10:29

You're taking your two vamp checks to the grave to spite village cus they won't help the inq win?
Tracey Thu 10:29

WE DONT WIN
Operative Thu 10:29

We don't win if there are masons
Tracey Thu 10:29

unless masons are dead
Thu 10:29

how are you not getting this?
Operative Thu 10:29

So it's not spite
Higgins Thu 10:29

Fanty, ignore them, they just want to kill your team :)
Operative Thu 10:29

Its playing in our own interested
Fanty Thu 10:29

Okay, but you understand that the masons help the village and we are village, correct?
Operative Thu 10:30

WE ARE ILLUMINATI YOU FOOL
Tracey Thu 10:30

We help the village too
Thu 10:30

we want the village to win
Operative Thu 10:30

Lol
Tracey Thu 10:30

NEED the village to win
Simon Thu 10:30

You realise that vamps will purposefully keep Masons alive right? Plus vamps have fams to respawn into
Fanty Thu 10:30

So you're preaching to a bunch of people who have no interest in helping you beyond village interests, but you want them to kill village?
Stitch Thu 10:30

if village doesn't win
Tracey Thu 10:30

so obviously we will be pushing that hard
Higgins Thu 10:30

i know why we have the thing "illu doesn't exist"
Stitch Thu 10:30

illuminati doesn't win
Higgins Thu 10:30

and they shouldn't exist :)
Tracey Thu 10:30

Yes Fanty because we have info and roles that can help the village win
Fanty Thu 10:30

Imo, you've revealed yourselves way way too early, how can you expect anyone, vamps or village, to want to kill the masons now guys?
Operative Thu 10:30

Illuminati could have won until the drunk bs happened
Tracey Thu 10:31

We had no choice
Fanty Thu 10:31

It benefits basically everyone to keep them alive now that you've revealed yourselves and said you're taking the vamp checks to the grave
Simon Thu 10:31

So what roles do you have?
River Thu 10:31

ALL THE ROLES
Operative Thu 10:31

It honestly doesn't matter. I don't think we can win
Tracey Thu 10:31

We wont say who is in our team
Higgins Thu 10:31

and you didn't even tell us you get a vamp before the drunk bs happened?
Tracey Thu 10:31

the rest are keeping queit
Higgins Thu 10:31

you kept it until the "drunk bs" happened and then tell us this
Thu 10:31

sure
Operative Thu 10:31

Especially with villagers being unwilling to help us at all
Tracey Thu 10:31

correct i could have told you yesterday but obiously I wanted Niska or sherrif to die, in case they really are mason
Higgins Thu 10:32

i mean even before that, i don't believe you got 2 vamps in one day
River Thu 10:32

I prefer to lose to vamp, than letting tracey win.
Thu 10:32

No problems for me
Fanty Thu 10:32

Well, you can either help village win and get a minor win for yourselves, or you can take your vamp checks to the grave and make vamps king
Operative Thu 10:32

I want the vamps to win
Tracey Thu 10:32

yes river I understand you are incapable of containing your rage
River Thu 10:32

you play like that operative
Thu 10:32

that part is obvious
SheriffBourne Thu 10:32

Setup goal: create division within the village
Thu 10:32

Objective complete
River Thu 10:33

You're hindering my chances of winning, so you got to go.
Operative Thu 10:33

Well when you're trying to kill my team I don't really want to help you
Fanty Thu 10:33

Was gonna say, they're are some salty salty subfractions going around
Tracey Thu 10:33

Go to anger management or something
SheriffBourne Thu 10:33

^
Thu 10:33

Ironic
River Thu 10:33

you go to the GY first.
Thu 10:33

..!..
Fanty Thu 10:33

Operative, you realise the vamps are also against you yes?
Tracey Thu 10:33

As I was saying, our proposal is this - kill niska today (someone who may even be evil, we arent sure) and tomorrow we will give you a vamp
Fanty Thu 10:33

At least village are partially for you
Stitch Thu 10:33

"subfractions"
Tracey Thu 10:33

Same agrument flip it round to you
Operative Thu 10:33

No they aren't
Stitch Thu 10:33

quality
Higgins Thu 10:33

they won't relise anything :)
Operative Thu 10:33

Village is trying yo kill my team mate
Moderator Thu 10:33

Tracey votes to lynch Niska
Operative Thu 10:34

And won't move their votes so
Stitch Thu 10:34

can someone explain to me what is going on
Moderator Thu 10:34

Operative votes to lynch Niska
Fanty Thu 10:34

Tracey, you are asking everyone to kill a possible villager to get info that we have no proof that you have the next day?
Operative Thu 10:34

I hope inq don't just bend over and be like I still win if wc roles are here right
Higgins Thu 10:34

illu is full of bs, they are baiting about 2 vamp to convince us kill mason :)
Fanty Thu 10:34

Would you concede that that is a difficult deal for people to take?
Operative Thu 10:34

They're already voting for a villager
River Thu 10:34

vote tracey guys
Simon Thu 10:34

Op and Tracey "know" two vamps but refuse to tell the village unless the village kill a village member first
Stitch Thu 10:35

ffs what the fuck is going on
Tracey Thu 10:35

Stitch: what's happening is people are failing to grasp that whilst we are all town, we are town with different win conditions so it's only semi cooperative at this point
Operative Thu 10:35

I'd like you to move your votes off Tracey
Fanty Thu 10:35

Tracey think about it from village point of view, you really think it's a good deal for us?
Operative Thu 10:35

Then we'll talk about a vamp
Tracey Thu 10:35

I understand your concerns but this is the best we have at this point
Thu 10:35

if we leave masons unchecked they are going to be alive and we will lose
Operative Thu 10:35

Village are lynching a villager rn so they aren't very reasonable
Fanty Thu 10:36

Tracey, if that's the best you have, then you will just get killed
Simon Thu 10:36

If we move our votes you'll tell us who a vamp is?
SheriffBourne Thu 10:36

Tracey, you seem to forget that people aren't inherently favouring Illuminati. So they might be indifferent to you. If you then say that you have good info but are unwilling to share it, you are relying on goodwill or cooperation in the village, which you haven't built on.
Fanty Thu 10:36

Operative, you are literally asking us to lynch a different likely villager
Tracey Thu 10:36

No because you'll kill the vamp not the mason
Thu 10:36

we want you to kill the mason
Thu 10:36

then the vamp
Fanty Thu 10:36

You realise we have NOTHING to show that you and Tracey are village right?
Tracey Thu 10:36

Correct
Higgins Thu 10:36

we don't even know your info is true or not, you didn't tell us after you found it and kept it until today and use it to bait us
Tracey Thu 10:36

We didnt want to but we had no choice
Operative Thu 10:36

Seer checked me as village fancy
Fanty Thu 10:36

I hate to say it but I agree with Higgins
River Thu 10:37

Negotiations failed. let's move on.
Operative Thu 10:37

Higgins you literally checked me as village
River Thu 10:37

we stack on Tracey until we find a vamp
Tracey Thu 10:37

HEY EVERYONE IM RIVER LISTEN TO MEEEEEEE
Operative Thu 10:37

Lol
Fanty Thu 10:37

I'm not convinced we kill Tracey and Op
River Thu 10:37

and you tell me about anger management :)
Higgins Thu 10:37

yea, and i could still be insane
Fanty Thu 10:37

But I am convinced that they should come up with better deals
Higgins Thu 10:37

https://media1.tenor.com/images/1742d2899ac2d797d88bd70a8e048587/tenor.gif
Tracey Thu 10:37

I'm not angry, i'm mocking
Thu 10:37

there's a big difference
River Thu 10:37

that's what I say every time I'm salty.
Tracey Thu 10:37

Fanty we dont have better deals
Fanty Thu 10:37

Please stop whining at each other in caps, it's a game of werewolves, relax.
Tracey Thu 10:38

This is what we have
Fanty Thu 10:38

Tracey, revealing one of your two vamps now so that village can talk about veracity of the claim is a good idea
Tracey Thu 10:38

it's only going to get worse for us from here
Operative Thu 10:38

I don't think we have a choice here since I imagine the MW will eat us
Fanty Thu 10:38

Then village talks, then you still have your second vamp check
River Thu 10:38

Wont be sad about it.
Simon Thu 10:38

Op, you said you'd tell us a vamp if we move our votes. Are you willing to keep to that?
River Thu 10:38

I wont move
Higgins Thu 10:38

i will come back later after this bs is finish
Operative Thu 10:39

River refusing to negotiate is so petty
Fanty Thu 10:39

Would it not be reasonable to tell us one vamp check then keep the other in reserve? Or do you not actually have two checks?
Operative Thu 10:39

Its great
Tracey Thu 10:39

We do have two checks
River Thu 10:39

petty? Only because I have nothing to do with your agenda?
Fanty Thu 10:39

Christ guys, please stop going on at each other about who is more petty
Simon Thu 10:39

Tracey, vamps aside why not give us your stalks?
Fanty Thu 10:39

Okay, Tracey and Op, would it not be reasonable to reveal one check so village can discuss the veracity of it?
Operative Thu 10:39

You're killing a villager
Tracey Thu 10:39

The problem we have is you dont seem at all amenable to working with us
River Thu 10:39

Sorry but going into negotiations at 20 players is ridicolous
Tracey Thu 10:39

we need you to want to kill masons, which you dont
River Thu 10:40

you're aware of the fact I have no reason to kill them?
Fanty Thu 10:40

How do I not seem amenable to working with you?
SheriffBourne Thu 10:40

Illuminati, if you're stronger than us Masons, you need to prove it to the village. Otherwise they won't ditch us in favour of you.
Tracey Thu 10:40

at this point we're only asking you to kill a "mason" who made a ridiculous claim about being a backup ML
Thu 10:40

Simon because that would give away the vamp
River Thu 10:40

You're blackmailing us, this is not "working with us"
Tracey Thu 10:40

we are negotiating
Stitch Thu 10:40

ok who is which faction
Fanty Thu 10:40

I'm proposing an exchange of info, you're proposing we lynch someone or you'll blackmail us with your vamp checks...
Stitch Thu 10:41

just so i know
Tracey Thu 10:41

Because we dont believe that you will lynch masons
Thu 10:41

based on what you've all been saying
Simon Thu 10:41

Your terms are currently not acceptable. Time to adjust them
Fanty Thu 10:41

Man, being an evil right now must be so popcorn-worthy
Tracey Thu 10:41

We are up for negotiation but can you suggest a way round our problem?
Fanty Thu 10:42

Tracey, I have repeatedly said, reveal one vamp check and everyone can discuss it. That way we still don't want you dead cus you have another vamp check, plus we can talk about how possible all the current claims are and you could negotiate for the second check
Tracey Thu 10:42

The vamp checks are all we have
Fanty Thu 10:42

But currently, we have no reason to trust either side
Tracey Thu 10:42

we only have two
Thu 10:42

and there are currently possibly 3 masons
Stitch Thu 10:43

fanty being a non subfaction village is popcorn-worth
SheriffBourne Thu 10:43

*throwing fuel to the fire* look at Tracey being up for negotation and compare it with yesterday, how she was all for negotiating!
Tracey Thu 10:43

and that number may rise tonight
Thu 10:43

fanty is a mason now, I told you that
Fanty Thu 10:43

Exactly, so give us one, if it's believable or possible or verifiable so we can consider whether we want the second one
SheriffBourne Thu 10:43

You should've recruited Fanty, Illuminati :)
Fanty Thu 10:43

Sigh, I'm not a mason, else I'd be more than happy to push for your deaths Tracey and Op
Thu 10:43

You're aware I'm the only villager currently defending you yes?
Nandi Thu 10:43

Making my vote.
Tracey Thu 10:43

Well sherrif visited you last night
Simon Thu 10:43

You have your checks, vamps, a strong team and a hidden team. Masons are out in the open and you can know who they recruit. You hardly have nothing else.
SheriffBourne Thu 10:43

Uhm, Fanty?
Moderator Thu 10:43

Nandi votes to lynch Higgins
SheriffBourne Thu 10:44

*not a Mason*?
Tracey Thu 10:44

if sherrif visited you last night then...
Operative Thu 10:44

Masons aren't gonna die and they have a kill so
SheriffBourne Thu 10:44

Fanty you might want to check your morning report
Tracey Thu 10:44

If thats the case then Sherrif isnt a mason
Fanty Thu 10:44

Lmao hahaha
Thu 10:44

Just checked back
Thu 10:44

I'm totally a mason
SheriffBourne Thu 10:44

MAPLEMASON
Stitch Thu 10:44

tracey you visited sheriff
Tracey Thu 10:44

yes i know
Fanty Thu 10:44

Sorry, missed it in all those death notifications sorry
Tracey Thu 10:44

and sherrif visited fanty
Fanty Thu 10:45

Well, I feel silly now
Thu 10:45

I welcome our new mason overlords
Tracey Thu 10:45

hence why i know he is not going to be amenable to what we have to say
Stitch Thu 10:45

oh god what
Operative Thu 10:45

Yeah ok so f thus. Bringing the masons back fucked us and I cba. Maybe I'll check back later but I don't really see a point.
Mal Thu 10:45

ah subfaction drama, good to see that the subfactions are working as intended!
Tracey Thu 10:45

Yeah masons die, mod thinks thats unfair and brings them back?
Thu 10:45

okay
Fanty Thu 10:45

Still, it'd be better to work together until the evils are dead, everything I said before remains true
Operative Thu 10:45

Lol it's so bs
SheriffBourne Thu 10:45

Tracey, the setup was about us competing
Simon Thu 10:46

Mal, claim please
SheriffBourne Thu 10:46

ML dying N1 isn't along these lines
Operative Thu 10:46

Your team died on night 1
Thu 10:46

Boo hpo
Tracey Thu 10:46

Thats because they were dumb and tried to recruit
Fanty Thu 10:46

Tracey, you can be salty at the mod all you want, but the drinks and undetermined people exist exactly for that reason
Operative Thu 10:46

Pick better recruits
Fanty Thu 10:46

The drunks,*
Thu 10:46

They exist exactly for balance reasons
SheriffBourne Thu 10:46

I had nothing to do with the ML of N1 even, lol
Fanty Thu 10:46

You really wanna be salty about the mechanics of it?
Operative Thu 10:46

Village are never going to side with illu over masons
SheriffBourne Thu 10:46

So I'm not sure your insult is going in the right direction
Mal Thu 10:46

Simon: before I claim, are you full?
SheriffBourne Thu 10:46

SUPER SALT SUPER SALT MEGA HYPER EXPLOSIVE SALT BOMB
Simon Thu 10:46

Sadly yes until Sun
Stitch Thu 10:46

lol
Fanty Thu 10:47

If you want to get lynched and withhold all info then go nuts, but complaining here about the mod won't solve anythinf
Operative Thu 10:47

Lynching people who are village is so dumb
Tracey Thu 10:47

I still think it's not a bad idea to lynch Niska
Thu 10:47

This "mod made me a new role" claim
Operative Thu 10:47

Like the pressure votes clearly aren't going to make us give the info
Mal Thu 10:47

Simon: That's unfortunate :(
Tracey Thu 10:47

It's potentially bad for us and potneitally bad for village
Stitch Thu 10:47

all illuminati are gonna get eaten
Simon Thu 10:48

Lynching village is dumb so why make us do it?
Tracey Thu 10:48

how about we lynch them today and tomorrow we will reveal a vamp
Stitch Thu 10:48

by fanty
Tracey Thu 10:48

you're lynching village if you lynch me
Operative Thu 10:48

But if you want to kill villagers then do it
Simon Thu 10:48

Op that's exactly what you want us to do...
Operative Thu 10:48

I don't really have any interest anymore since we're gonna get eaten by MW
SheriffBourne Thu 10:48

Operative Thu 10:47 Lynching people who are village is so dumb
Thu 10:48

===> WE SHOULD LYNCH MASONS
Simon Thu 10:48

I personally want to kill vamps
Nandi Thu 10:48

I would like Badger to claim.
SheriffBourne Thu 10:49

Let's focus on other stuff
Tracey Thu 10:49

you want to lynch me which gets no gain to your objective, we want you to lynch a mason which gets us closer to our objective
Thu 10:49

therefore not dumb
Nandi Thu 10:49

No, that's my priority.
Stitch Thu 10:49

YOU GUYS GON' GET EATEN!
Simon Thu 10:49

Mal what's your claim?
SheriffBourne Thu 10:49

Jubal is on my personal watch list, so I'll add that to the list of people who need to claim
Operative Thu 10:49

She already claimed
Tracey Thu 10:49

We understand this is not an ideal situation for us but it's all we have right now
Nandi Thu 10:50

Guys, pressure Badger,
Moderator Thu 10:50

Nandi votes to lynch Badger
Operative Thu 10:50

Why not
Moderator Thu 10:50

Operative votes to lynch Badger
Moderator Thu 10:50

SheriffBourne votes to lynch Badger
Mal Thu 10:50

Simon: I'm fairly fanatical.
Simon Thu 10:50

Nandi what's your claim?
Thu 10:50

Purifier?
Mal Thu 10:50

BIngo
Simon Thu 10:50

Any visits?
Operative Thu 10:51

Simon I hope you are going to act in the inq best interests btw
Nandi Thu 10:51

I'm gonna get killed for this, but I think it's worth all I hage:
Operative Thu 10:51

Get those wc users
Nandi Thu 10:51

*have
Thu 10:51

Illuminati Lookout.
Thu 10:51

I saw who killed Inara.
Operative Thu 10:51

Dammiy
Simon Thu 10:51

Who?
Nandi Thu 10:51

(Actually, I saw three visitors.
Operative Thu 10:51

Nandi -.-
Moderator Thu 10:51

Simon votes to lynch Badger
Nandi Thu 10:52

Lenore, Badger, and Higgins visited the Illuminati last night.
Operative Thu 10:52

Fgs
Thu 10:52

I'm out
Mal Thu 10:52

nope, I've not visited anyone. Was very tempted by Stitch though with his "I didn't revive Kaylee" crap
Nandi Thu 10:52

This was the best move, telling the Village!
Mal Thu 10:52

But figured that's not pro-village.
Operative Thu 10:52

No it isn't
Tracey Thu 10:52

It wasnt but okay
Nandi Thu 10:52

I couldn't risk waiting a night!
Tracey Thu 10:53

They're just going to kill the vamps and not help us
Operative Thu 10:53

Well now were really fucked
Tracey Thu 10:53

so we lose
Operative Thu 10:53

Great
Thu 10:53

They're just going to eat us at night
Thu 10:53

Gg bs masons
Mal Thu 10:53

I'm actually not against killing a mason, it is possible for all 3 subfactions to win
Tracey Thu 10:54

I agree it is
Thu 10:54

We can have 1 mason alive
Mal Thu 10:54

But ilu wanting masons dead isn't much different from inq wanting all WC dead
Tracey Thu 10:54

and the masons, dead ones, will still win if we help village
Mal Thu 10:54

not sure why people are against 1 and not the other
Operative Thu 10:54

Yeah apparently we're terrible for wanting to win
Tracey Thu 10:54

Dead masons are still winners if town wins
Simon Thu 10:55

No, you're terrible for not telling us the vamps
Thu 10:55

Big difference
Operative Thu 10:55

Hello one of us already did
Tracey Thu 10:55

We will tell you the vamps but we need to be sure the masons die
Thu 10:55

Yeah one of us just gave you that for free
Thu 10:55

so there you go
Simon Thu 10:56

Why didn't you recruit the Maple?
Nandi Thu 10:56

They asked me to claim.
Tracey Thu 10:56

no more recuits
Nandi Thu 10:56

What would've been the best thing to say then?
Tracey Thu 10:56

You can say you're illu but dont tell them all the info, it's all we have
Thu 10:56

too late now
Thu 10:56

they'll lynch the vamps, which is great, but leave the masons
Thu 10:56

and you lose
Thu 10:56

well done
Operative Thu 10:57

Lol
Thu 10:57

Some people still not moving votes
Thu 10:57

RiP
Tracey Thu 10:57

Mal made a good point though it is possible for all subfactions to win
Moderator Thu 10:58

Fanty votes to lynch Badger
Fanty Thu 10:58

Happy to pressure Badger for now. The alternative to him being a vamp is the illuminati all being vamps and coordinating something quite extraordinary
Tracey Thu 10:58

Yes, we want certain memebers of the village to die - just like the inq also want that (or to cleanse if they are able)
Thu 10:58

but we can all win against vamps
Thu 10:58

we just have to make sure everyone's objectives are complete
Thu 10:59

and our dead mason friends will win with us
Operative Thu 10:59

Inq must realise they need to kill seer and GV but probably won't try for it
River Thu 10:59

lol
Operative Thu 10:59

2x masons
River Thu 10:59

I'm laughing my ass off
Thu 10:59

god your team is a "very strong" mess.
Thu 10:59

buahaha
Thu 10:59

plz don't recruit me out of spite
Thu 11:00

better die than join that club
Operative Thu 11:01

Is badger your vm river?
River Thu 11:04

f off
Operative Thu 11:04

Lol
Thu 11:04

Calm down
River Thu 11:04

Not gonna talk to you clowns any more.
Tracey Thu 11:04

River there's no need to be so aggresive
Operative Thu 11:04

Good
Tracey Thu 11:04

We are all just playing to our own objectives
Operative Thu 11:04

Not really interested in someone so aggressive
Tracey Thu 11:05

I'm sorry you're incapable of processing that
River Thu 11:05

no more checks from me until Tracey is dead
Mal Thu 11:05

Op: You can bet your ass if Simon was to recruit me I'll be purifying seers, GVs, Prots, the lot ;)
Tracey Thu 11:05

now who is holding people to ransom
Operative Thu 11:05

Lol good
Simon Thu 11:05

Mal please do start
Tracey Thu 11:05

if you're looking at blackmail, there's some right there
Thu 11:06

except the reason for it is personal, not based on objectives
Operative Thu 11:06

How are illuminati ever supposed to win
Thu 11:06

Like serious question
River Thu 11:07

My objective is to win as village, not as Mason or Illu what ever
Simon Thu 11:07

Recruit a MW would have been a good start
Tracey Thu 11:07

yes and we want that too - that is our objective as well, but we have another one
Operative Thu 11:07

But we didn't know who he was until 1. Masons were back and 2. Had no recruits
Tracey Thu 11:08

sadly the mod woke up some drunks at just the right time for that to happen not in our favour
Badger Thu 11:08

Hi there.
Mal Thu 11:08

River: you realise that the village-win doesn't count for the subfactions though if they don't meet their requirements, so they have to be selfish about it
Badger Thu 11:08

I really need to come online earlier. Always too much to catch up on.
Simon Thu 11:08

Badger, claim please
Badger Thu 11:08

I'm Maple.
Tracey Thu 11:08

River doesnt understand that
Badger Thu 11:08

I killed Bester N2
Simon Thu 11:09

And who last night?
Badger Thu 11:09

Yesterday I killed Inara because I suspected her of being vamp. I thought my kill wouldn't go through and my plan was to let the village know, that I couldn't kill her.
Thu 11:09

So I did kill our prot.
Operative Thu 11:09

You killed a PROT?!
Badger Thu 11:09

I regret that, but I was convinced she was vamp.
Operative Thu 11:09

Wtf
Fanty Thu 11:09

Badger
Thu 11:09

Dude
Badger Thu 11:09

I know.
Fanty Thu 11:09

What a horrible claim haha
Operative Thu 11:09

You didn't even have to eat
Simon Thu 11:10

That's hilarious
Fanty Thu 11:10

Please, explain why you thought she was vamp then?
Badger Thu 11:10

I did have to eat I somehow my target tonight will be protected.
Fanty Thu 11:10

If you killed n2, you don't have to kill n4?
Simon Thu 11:11

So you risked it on a night immune role? You realise that doesn't add up?
Fanty Thu 11:11

So you took a hunch and ate a claimed and believed protector, when you could've gone for literally anyone else or waited a night and gone for someone who likely wasn't protected. The odds of someone not being protected would be 1/20
Thu 11:11

And now 0/19 now that you killed the prot
Badger Thu 11:11

I thought she was vamp because Shepherd (when claiming stalker) said Inara didn't move and she confirmed him. Then when Shepherd was dug as fam the next day, I was pretty much convinced he was Inaras fam.
Tracey Thu 11:11

Guys they're vamp, we gave you that info.
Fanty Thu 11:12

Why not speak up when I made my claim? Why not verify your claim by killing the inactive people?
Operative Thu 11:12

Also if you thought she was q vamp you can't eat her
Badger Thu 11:12

I did kill Bester, an inactive dude.
Fanty Thu 11:12

My vote stays on Badger.
Badger Thu 11:12

I acted on my suspicions. You may choose to not agree with that.
JubalEarly Thu 11:13

le sigh
Operative Thu 11:13

YOU CANT EAT VAMPS
Badger Thu 11:13

I KNOW!
Operative Thu 11:13

So why bother?
Tracey Thu 11:13

Badger we already outed you as vamp earlier
JubalEarly Thu 11:13

oh Badger is a vamp?
Tracey Thu 11:13

So it's a nice try, but sadly futile
Operative Thu 11:13

If she's a vamp she doesn't die. The only way she dies is if she's lit
Thu 11:14

So why would you even both
Thu 11:14

Bother
JubalEarly Thu 11:14

if we believe Tracey not much reason to argue this with Badger (but I guess it couldn't hurt...)
Badger Thu 11:14

Which is why i thought my kill wouldn't go through, so I would report it back to the village. I didn't have to eat last night, which is why I risked trying to eat a vamp.
Operative Thu 11:14

But she's a prot
Thu 11:14

She could self prot
Badger Thu 11:14

And I didn't believe it.
Thu 11:15

She could. But I was pretty sure she was selfprotting the night before.
Operative Thu 11:15

Ok I don't really need to argue this with you
Thu 11:15

So if she self prot She isnt a vamp and you just kill a pet
Thu 11:15

Prot
Badger Thu 11:15

Anyway. I gave you my claim and provided my reasons. I already said yesterday that I suspected Inara of being vamp. You can look it up.
Simon Thu 11:16

/
JubalEarly Thu 11:16

wait Op aren't you illu?
Thu 11:16

like he's confirmed vamp to you?
Thu 11:16

or something?
Thu 11:16

how was that confirmed btw
Operative Thu 11:16

I know he is. Was just having a discussion
JubalEarly Thu 11:16

ooh ok
Badger Thu 11:17

What I'm curious to know is how the illu thinks they've confirmed me as vamp?
JubalEarly Thu 11:17

@Sheriff btw I claimed already
Badger Thu 11:17

Did they see me kill Bester?
Operative Thu 11:17

You killed someone on our team bucko and we have a lookout
JubalEarly Thu 11:17

and no faction should want me dead except for evils so yaaaaaaay....kindaa....
Fanty Thu 11:17

I find it weird Badger that you didn't mention you killed bester on d3 as it would've been very helpfuil for everyoen trying to work out what happened. You even said yourself that youd idn't lknow what was happening the next day. You also said 'i don't want to risk losing a MW' in reference to me, but if you were a MW yourself, it certainly wouldn't have been as big a risk
Badger Thu 11:17

Oh, so you only just today confirmed me as vamp?
Operative Thu 11:18

And your arguments confirm that you weren't a militia or me because they are garbage
Thu 11:18

Mw
Simon Thu 11:18

Either way thanks for killing a nasty WC user
Fanty Thu 11:18

Badger isn't confirmed Vamp just yet, there is apossibility he isn't a vamp,l but it's seeming unlikely
JubalEarly Thu 11:19

well I feel less bad about not visiting Jayne now
Thu 11:19

since redirect is now very unlikely
Badger Thu 11:19

Honestly I thought (and still do think) that two Maples are very possible. I too believe that this is a game of subfactions, so I think the only evils are vamps. So the village would IMO be given a few killing roles. And I didn't want to risk losing you, because that would leave the village with one less PR.
JubalEarly Thu 11:20

fair enough point but still kinda meh
Thu 11:20

would make sense that the subsections need MWs for kills though
Thu 11:20

subfactions*
Simon Thu 11:20

Hey Fanty question for ya: do you intend to start munching on Illu or if told who they are will you munch on fams for the good of the village?
River Thu 11:20

plz munch tracey
JubalEarly Thu 11:20

Masons don't care about illu, right?
Thu 11:21

it's just the other way around?
Tracey Thu 11:21

Does anyone else get the impression River doesn't like me, or am I being paranoid?
Badger Thu 11:21

Anyway. I realise there's no way to confirm me, as I am not part of any village subfaction. Had I been part of a village subfaction I would've had team mates that I could share my theory with. But I acted on my own and I truly had the best intentions.
JubalEarly Thu 11:21

so if Fanty is mason his goal should be kill off vamps right?
Thu 11:21

unless he is worried about illu having a killing role of their own
River Thu 11:21

Well the inqisition folks were not a dick about inara, but this illu shit really makes my blood boil.
JubalEarly Thu 11:22

I mean...it kinda makes sense that they don't want to lose
Tracey Thu 11:22

Because you are incapable of understanding multi-faction game
Operative Thu 11:22

How dare we try and win
JubalEarly Thu 11:22

like a little bit
Tracey Thu 11:22

if we win, you win too
Thu 11:22

by the way
JubalEarly Thu 11:22

like I don't want to lose
River Thu 11:22

yeah but it's not my concern though
JubalEarly Thu 11:22

yaaa but its theirs
Thu 11:22

empathy
Thu 11:22

or at least get in their shoes
Tracey Thu 11:22

We will help you win river
JubalEarly Thu 11:22

same thing
River Thu 11:23

my concern is them wanting to lynch masons is bad for me as normall villager, since all subfactions count towards parity
Fanty Thu 11:23

Hey Simon. I'd prefer to get rid of vamps and fams initially definitely. Imo, subfaction game is for later on
Badger Thu 11:23

And I would also like to say that I believe it's too early to start a war between village subfactions. We are 20 players left and have I believe at least two vamp basements. I think it
Operative Thu 11:23

You can't see why we would want to do that
Thu 11:23

Like we have to do that to win
River Thu 11:23

I can see it, and I think you're dicks for going at it with 20 players left
Badger Thu 11:23

is cruicial to rid the village of at lelast one vamp and their fam before you start an internal war.
Tracey Thu 11:23

we didnt have a choice
Operative Thu 11:23

River thinking all sub factions should just act like masons
JubalEarly Thu 11:23

I mean I think at this point vamps should definitely be the focus for any subfaction but that's just my humble opinion
Tracey Thu 11:24

we were hoping to make it to at least sunday
River Thu 11:24

I hope you wont
Operative Thu 11:24

Wow
Tracey Thu 11:24

You realise we are partially on your side, right?
Thu 11:24

like if we win, you win as well
JubalEarly Thu 11:24

when was Inara recruited btw
Fanty Thu 11:24

my god, river and tracey just ignore eaxch other's messages, it's so dull and clogs the chat
JubalEarly Thu 11:24

N2?
River Thu 11:24

"partially"
Operative Thu 11:24

No point, her vote is still on you traceyc
River Thu 11:24

that's a problem for me
Operative Thu 11:24

Not the vamp so she's very unreasonable
Tracey Thu 11:24

Yeah you're right I said i'd ignore her and havent I will now
JubalEarly Thu 11:24

JubalSad
Tracey Thu 11:25

*ignores river*
JubalEarly Thu 11:25

JubalIgnoredToo
Operative Thu 11:25

Like acting in our own interests is a problem for her
Thu 11:25

Can you imagine if she were in a sub faction. She'd be so confused
Tracey Thu 11:25

Fanty as strange as it sounds I think we should work together
River Thu 11:25

lol
Moderator Thu 11:25

Badger votes to lynch Zoe
Tracey Thu 11:25

masons win if we win too, even the dead ones
JubalEarly Thu 11:25

That was something I always wondered
Thu 11:25

do you really win if you're dead
Thu 11:25

cause like
Tracey Thu 11:25

of course
Badger Thu 11:26

I have to go now, but I will return later. I leave my vote on Zoe for now, as I think the quickest way to killing vamps is to go throught the lurkers.
JubalEarly Thu 11:26

I guess in this world there is definitely an afterlife so seems fair
Tracey Thu 11:26

HM would be a really shit role if you didnt :p
JubalEarly Thu 11:26

ya that's what I always thought lol
Thu 11:26

like do you do your job lol
Simon Thu 11:27

Moving on. With all this recruiting an OW wouldn't be a shocking inclusion
JubalEarly Thu 11:27

really?
Thu 11:27

I'd be shocked
Operative Thu 11:27

Hope they kill River lol
River Thu 11:27

Still think this is basement wars, and one of them is full of shit
JubalEarly Thu 11:27

too few deaths imo
Thu 11:27

River you think one of the subfactions aint lit?
Thu 11:27

cause Illu seems pretty lit
River Thu 11:27

yeah
JubalEarly Thu 11:28

with Inara and confirming Badger killed her
Thu 11:28

regardless of what badger is
River Thu 11:28

this comment was about the OW suggestion
JubalEarly Thu 11:28

and Inq also seems pretty lit from starting early and getting all their checks right
River Thu 11:28

I think it's basement wars, not OW/undead/covies
JubalEarly Thu 11:28

I agree with that
Simon Thu 11:28

Masons seem the most unlit
JubalEarly Thu 11:28

also agree with that
River Thu 11:28

agreed
JubalEarly Thu 11:29

Fanty are you a Fammy now?
River Thu 11:29

Still better them winning than tracey
Simon Thu 11:29

Fanty could be fam
Operative Thu 11:29

Simon, i agree i think if we play this right all sub factions can win
JubalEarly Thu 11:29

kinda wish they just got checked and we coulda had this confirmed or not
Simon Thu 11:29

Higgins you may want to check before you're purified
Operative Thu 11:30

So sub factions work together to ensure mutual victory
JubalEarly Thu 11:30

why do I feel like im getting killed at night
Thu 11:30

:|
Thu 11:30

just a dead man walking here
Operative Thu 11:30

No I think illu will probably die tonight
Simon Thu 11:30

We should reveal our members before the refresh
JubalEarly Thu 11:30

are there like 4 now?
Simon Thu 11:30

So we don't overlap
JubalEarly Thu 11:30

3?
Thu 11:31

only two recruits right?
Thu 11:31

and Law is dead
Simon Thu 11:31

I'm keen to get Mal
JubalEarly Thu 11:31

did he claim
Simon Thu 11:31

Purifier
JubalEarly Thu 11:31

you're keen to get him as in recruit him then?
Simon Thu 11:32

Also how is GV not dead yet?
JubalEarly Thu 11:32

I misunderstood that lol
Thu 11:32

he got the behold correct right?
Thu 11:32

I mean Tracey could be fam
Simon Thu 11:32

Vamps have to be keen to get rid of a possible revive
JubalEarly Thu 11:32

but he still wouldn't know unless there was a code
Thu 11:32

and I don't think she spoke yet
Fanty Thu 11:33

if I was fammy, would I have a massive hardon for killing vamps? I can kill familiars at night, point me towards one if you like
JubalEarly Thu 11:33

well
Thu 11:33

you got me there
Thu 11:33

maybe a bunch of vamps all tried to recruit stitch and all failed? or does that kill him
Simon Thu 11:34

Please kill Stitch. Likely vamp or fam
Fanty Thu 11:34

I killed n3 when i HAD to and I killed an inactive. I killed n4 to prove my litness and went for another inactive. I'm not sure what else I can do to prove my litness besides having someone check me
JubalEarly Thu 11:34

sorry im on 0 sleep for meta reasons so a little loopy today :|
Thu 11:34

brb for about 5 hours or so
Thu 11:34

unless I"m tempted to jump in again...
Jayne Thu 11:52

Good morning. I am reading back through, first thing I came to involved me. I was not redirected.
Thu 11:53

So go suck an egg Higgins. ;-)
Operative Thu 12:08

I find it really strange that inq is here when all evil aren't wc users
Thu 12:08

Guess this is an all out village brawl
River Thu 12:09

Yo I clamed down and thought about the whole thing
Thu 12:10

And came to a conclusion
Operative Thu 12:10

Which is
Simon Thu 12:14

Jayne what's your visit?
Thu 12:15

Higgins is now marked by any chance?
Thu 12:19

River? Your conclusion?
Jayne Thu 12:21

Okay so finally read through all of this.
Thu 12:22

So nobody mentioned I cleared Inara of being a vamp yesterday.
Thu 12:23

Which annoys me regarding the MW claim eating her because he thought she was a vamp.
Thu 12:24

Also, for better or worse that is why I checked her and why I claimed.
River Thu 12:24

inara being vm impossible anyway
Thu 12:24

so what's the point?
Jayne Thu 12:24

Just that nobody should believe someone today who said they thought she was a vamp last night. Or believe them less.
Mal Thu 12:25

I don't think anyone really believe Badger
Jayne Thu 12:25

Okay good.
SheriffBourne Thu 12:26

To add to that
Thu 12:26

Thu 11:21 Anyway. I realise there's no way to confirm me, as I am not part of any village subfaction. Had I been part of a village subfaction I would've had team mates that I could share my theory with. But I acted on my own and I truly had the best intentions.
Thu 12:26

This reads as a signal to Familiars: don't rescue me, don't tie yourself to me
Thu 12:26

(it was Badger who said that btw)
River Thu 12:28

Obvious I'm the vam
Thu 12:28

defending badger
Jayne Thu 12:28

Jubal does not use witchcraft. I was not recruited into anything and I am a bit sus of that.
Mal Thu 12:29

So we still have 1 hidden inq member then? Simon, Fess, Lawrence and a non-named recruit
Jayne Thu 12:30

So I feel lonely as a normal villager with no team and I am not sure what to make of thus faction war.
Thu 12:31

But I think it makes no sense for inq. not to grab me up but I really don't know so make of that what you will.
Mal Thu 12:31

I mean, either of us is a good option for them come Sunday night
Jayne Thu 12:32

Ya I am a bit out of my depth here trying to get my head around all the faction wars.
Thu 12:33

So just telling the truth and not making any moves which is probably bad, but it is all I have.
Moderator Thu 12:34

Mal votes to lynch Badger
Jayne Thu 12:34

Can you explain why badger would claim that?
Mal Thu 12:35

I'm going to put that there for now, but I'm not adverse to thinning out the masons slightly to help placate the ilu somewhat. We all want to win afterall and it's better to have all of the village contributing all of their information
Thu 12:36

All 3 subfactions win if we end with only a single mason alive, and no wc users, so that goal is doable. (Remembering that all 3 get an extra recruit sunday night)
Operative Thu 12:37

I like you mal, very reasonable. I'm happy to work toward mutual victory
Jayne Thu 12:37

I myself am super happy to trade masons for vamps. In my history any 1 to 1 trade villager for evil is good. Is that not so in this vamp game?
Thu 12:38

However I am not sure how this trade works as it could all be bullshit on the other side.
Thu 12:39

I am happy to trade any of you sub-faction mutts for evil actually.
Thu 12:40

Anyway I will check back in a while.
Operative Thu 12:42

I had a thought about that. What if we give a vamp and then the ML recruits them. ML dies if we're truthful and they have a backup ML in Niska. Vamp for masob
Thu 12:42

That would mean the masons have to honour that
Thu 12:43

It's an idea. But I think cooperative amongst factions is good
Jayne Thu 12:45

There is a problem with that.
Mal Thu 12:46

That assumes the ML has any recruiting options left, and that they're onboard for sacrificing
Jayne Thu 12:47

Oh wait I guess they know Niska is lit since they were chatting all night never mind. Niska was so bizarre yesterday I was still thinking he is probably full of it.
River Thu 12:47

I don't really trust any basement
Thu 12:48

none of them exceeds the size of a vm
Thu 12:48

and team
Jayne Thu 12:48

Ya of course the entire Mason clan could be a VM basement.
River Thu 12:48

or the illu
Mal Thu 12:48

River: "basement" specifically refers to VM teams, not subfaction teams
River Thu 12:48

I just said none of the subfactions exceeds VM team size
Jayne Thu 12:48

Or the inquisition I would say.
Tracey Thu 12:49

thats why we need to work together somewhat River
Thu 12:49

We have very common goals for the most part
River Thu 12:49

yeah but...
Thu 12:49

Inara can't speak so
Mal Thu 12:49

We all (Inq, Ilu, Masons, regular-village) want the vamps dead
Operative Thu 12:49

Well I was checked as village by the seer so I'm not vm
River Thu 12:49

you could be a vamp team
Operative Thu 12:49

I would have to be recruited last night
River Thu 12:49

so?
Operative Thu 12:49

Or seer would see fam
Thu 12:50

And I wanted to kill Niska yesterday
Thu 12:50

Because I wanted to kill a mason
River Thu 12:50

everyone wanted
Jayne Thu 12:50

Does it make sense for the inquisition to be in this game? I have no knowledge of game setup meta.
Operative Thu 12:50

Nope, everyone moved off him
River Thu 12:50

See and we're at the problem again.
Operative Thu 12:50

I find inq being here interesting
SheriffBourne Thu 12:50

I don't think we can rely on that knowledge anyway, Jayne. I think it fits the scenario well.
River Thu 12:50

You didn't vote in the interest of village
Thu 12:51

For me you crossed the rubicon today.
Operative Thu 12:51

I voted in my own interest AND at the time thought he could be lying so it's a winwin
Mal Thu 12:51

I wanted to kill Niska yesterday because I didn't like his claim. I still don't hugely like it but for now SheriffBourne has confirmed him, and Fanty has claimed recruited
River Thu 12:51

You made this a political slugfest not me
Jayne Thu 12:51

I also think it was inq who shut down talking about the game setup suddenly
Operative Thu 12:51

That's what three sub factions means
River Thu 12:51

no that was me @jayne
Thu 12:52

I wanna kill myself after every 3 hour setup discussion
Tracey Thu 12:52

I wanted to kill niska because for me it's bad either way - he's either backup ML or some evil
Operative Thu 12:52

Agreed Tracey
Tracey Thu 12:52

for the village perspective he *might* be this crazy new mason created just now
River Thu 12:52

how many duds you are?
Tracey Thu 12:52

but you know... maybe not
Operative Thu 12:52

River still doesn't seem to get that sub factions need to work toward their own goal whilst also helping village
River Thu 12:52

how many?
Thu 12:52

alive
Operative Thu 12:52

Like we can't just kill all vamps with 3 masons here
Jayne Thu 12:53

okay River - just for the moment I want to lodge the fact that Inq said the would recruit me and did not.
Operative Thu 12:53

Why do you need to know
River Thu 12:53

did they? when?
Operative Thu 12:53

Inq didn't recruit the WH?
Jayne Thu 12:53

Simon
River Thu 12:53

when
Thu 12:53

I got today they would like to?
Jayne Thu 12:53

yesterday I forget when exaclty
River Thu 12:53

quote
Thu 12:54

@operative I wanna rule out you being a vm basement. This can be done due to size
Jayne Thu 12:54

just after I claimed - argh mobile client scroll to that is tough
Mal Thu 12:54

River: it can't be
River Thu 12:54

why?
Tracey Thu 12:54

How many is in a VM basement?
Mal Thu 12:54

Ilu + LOokout + 2 recruits == VM + 3 recruits
Tracey Thu 12:54

right yeah both can be 4
River Thu 12:54

both is 4
Mal Thu 12:54

Same for Inq + Inquisitor + 2 recruits
River Thu 12:54

doesnt illu have 3 recs
Mal Thu 12:55

nope
River Thu 12:55

oh yeah nbm
Thu 12:55

nv
Tracey Thu 12:55

just 2 but we get another on sunday
River Thu 12:55

So illu is at 3
Thu 12:55

so why you even hide
Mal Thu 12:55

and also Masons + 2 recruits + superspecialmegamason-niska == 4 recruits
River Thu 12:55

wait
Tracey Thu 12:55

with a potential revive on a dead ML
River Thu 12:55

wasn't Inara ilu?
Jayne Thu 12:55

I will get my laptop out later and look it up - but if you care Simon said that
Tracey Thu 12:55

was being the operative word
Mal Thu 12:56

(Which actually gives Niska some air of litness if they exist to make the factions the same-size)
Thu 12:56

(Maybe they'll have a fixed number of total recruits rather than getting a fresh 2?)
Thu 12:56

(anyway, speculation)
River Thu 12:57

I think the inq claim that early would be suicide as basement. I think they get away with it, becuase no fking vamp cares about WC checks.
Tracey Thu 12:57

We wouldnt have come out if there wasnt the potential for a mason population explosion
Thu 12:57

We dont want the other ML revived
Thu 12:57

and we have no idea if niska is some ML backup
Operative Thu 12:57

I'd like the masons to stop recruiting
River Thu 12:58

look
Thu 12:58

what you do is NOT good for me
Tracey Thu 12:58

if the masons stop recruiting we can work to kill some vamps
Thu 12:58

it is because we want to kill vamps
Thu 12:58

and you want to kill vamps
Operative Thu 12:58

Neither is the inq but you're not mad at them wanting seer and GV dead
Moderator Thu 12:59

Jayne votes to lynch Simon
Operative Thu 12:59

Also note for future. In this multi faction setup. Masons need a downside against illu or inq
Jayne Thu 12:59

I want to know why they did not recruit me if that doesn't make sense.
River Thu 12:59

Inq so far didn't push their agenda too hard, the moment they purge off a useful role, they can go in the same f off basket as you guys.
Mal Thu 13:00

My above thoughts made me ponder something - if all the subfactions and basements are "the same size" and a drunk sobered into an ML - that would suggest that there is no revives? So would make a GV claim less likely to be lit. Maybe.
Operative Thu 13:00

But they have to do that to win
Tracey Thu 13:00

but at least we are being open about it
Operative Thu 13:00

You're not being fair.
River Thu 13:00

I don't care about you winning
Tracey Thu 13:00

we are saying we want to work with the village
River Thu 13:00

I care about me winning
Operative Thu 13:00

I'd love to see river in a sub faction
Tracey Thu 13:00

we care about us winning and we can make winning more likely for you
Thu 13:00

river
Wash Thu 13:00

y'all boys be dancin
Tracey Thu 13:00

you win if we win as well
Mal Thu 13:00

River: but they do, and if we want their help we should at least look at ways we can let as many people win as possible
Tracey Thu 13:00

and we can make winning more likely for you
Thu 13:01

we are a still villagers as well, with roles and abilities
Jayne Thu 13:01

I feel we have gone over this
Operative Thu 13:01

River basically saying if inq Or illu try and complete their second win condition they're shit
Thu 13:01

River Thu 12:59 Inq so far didn't push their agenda too hard, the moment they purge off a useful role, they can go in the same f off basket as you guys
Wash Thu 13:01

Good lord, today is big.
Tracey Thu 13:02

I understand there is a conflict between what we want and what a pure villager
Thu 13:02

wants
Operative Thu 13:02

Basically saying 8 villagers should fuck off ain't gonna work
Tracey Thu 13:02

but its not an outright conflict that we are 100% against each other
Wash Thu 13:02

Ah, Inq troubles.
River Thu 13:02

you should know my salt levels can get high enough to tank a game just to get my way.
Tracey Thu 13:02

like we can make it easier to win, but we need some things as well
Jayne Thu 13:02

One of you group of zealots needs to win with us. Make yourself useful.
Tracey Thu 13:02

We already told you a vamp
Thu 13:03

wasnt my choice but we did it
Mal Thu 13:03

Well in response that from River - I've already said that if I end up in inq, I'll be purifiying anyone who admits to being WC ;) - it's not at all unreasonable (and infact, is desirable) for the subfactions to play for their win conditions. It's not a "secondary" win condition, the game doesn't count them as winning if the condition isn't met, so it's important to them.
River Thu 13:03

count?
Thu 13:03

for which stats?
Mal Thu 13:04

There may not be stats published, but the game does track winners
Tracey Thu 13:04

you can't make an argument that people are playing and dont want to win. We have to assume everyone playing wants to win
Thu 13:04

or else what is the point
Wash Thu 13:04

Mark sits in the corner giggling as the village divides itself.
Mal Thu 13:04

And people themselves track their own wins etc
River Thu 13:04

look this isn't the first game with multiple subbies
Wash Thu 13:05

I'm just waiting for the moment that the Inquisition come out and reveal they've outright allied with Vamps.
River Thu 13:05

but I never had to deal with this bullshit with 20 players left.
Tracey Thu 13:05

it doesnt matter, this is this game
Thu 13:05

previous games are irrelevent, welcome to this game
River Thu 13:05

You sell the skin of the bear, before you killed it.
Tracey Thu 13:05

we work with what we have
River Thu 13:05

or you argue about the skin
Tracey Thu 13:05

im not going to explain again why we came out today - when we didn't want to
Thu 13:05

but we have, so this is what we're working with as a village
Mal Thu 13:06

I'm 100% in favour of people playing to their win conditions, so I'm willing to try and support that where possible where it aligns with my own
Tracey Thu 13:06

Same
Mal Thu 13:06

We all want vamps dead, so we should work towards that and see how we can fit in the others as needed
Wash Thu 13:06

Can someone give me an overview of the factions and those within them?
Tracey Thu 13:06

I'll even work with masons if we can guarantee only one will be alive at the end
River Thu 13:06

Not giving vamp results was against my interests
Thu 13:06

and this is where this started
Tracey Thu 13:06

Not *immediately* giving them
Thu 13:06

We are happy to give them because we want them dead as well
River Thu 13:06

you wanted to give them tomorrow
Thu 13:06

So don't play the hero
Wash Thu 13:06

Or am I just invisible here?
Tracey Thu 13:06

but you can understand that we need something else to happen
Mal Thu 13:06

They didn't say they wouldn't give them, but that they wanted a slightly smaller masonry first.
River Thu 13:06

you wanted to blackmail us
Tracey Thu 13:07

it wasnt blackmail it was negotiation
Thu 13:07

we have X but need assurances of Y
River Thu 13:07

call it what you want
Tracey Thu 13:07

you blackmailed everyone earlier when you stated you are giving no more intel until i am dead
Mal Thu 13:07

If we get both vamps immediately, then the village is going to want to just lynch them (because village) and if we do that and the game ends as a result, they lose
Tracey Thu 13:07

me, a vilager with a power role and working to kill vamps
Mal Thu 13:07

(also, inq lose due to the seer and gv still being alive)
River Thu 13:07

boo hoo
Thu 13:07

I win
Mal Thu 13:07

so there is a good chunk of village who won't want that to happen
Tracey Thu 13:07

you want me dead and are saying no more intel until that happens
Thu 13:07

thats blackmail
River Thu 13:08

so I'm playing for my win condition :)
Thu 13:08

so the arguments goes in circles
Tracey Thu 13:08

you're not though
Thu 13:08

because you're killing a villager with a power role
Thu 13:08

thats against your win condition
Mal Thu 13:08

But you also win if they win, so there's no reason not to humour them
River Thu 13:08

I did, you had 4 votes, your buddy came and gave the check for free
Thu 13:08

Oper almost RQ at that point which was funny as hell
Tracey Thu 13:08

we have a second one
Thu 13:08

still
Wash Thu 13:08

Fortnite Battle Royale
River Thu 13:09

that's why my vote is still on you
Mal Thu 13:09

Wash: we have all 3. Masons: [Kaylee], Fanty, SheriffBourne, Niska || Ilu: Operative, Nandi, Tracey [Inara] || Inq: Simon, Fess, Lawrence, Unknown - Members of the factions can correct me if I'm wrong there?
River Thu 13:09

don't play the good guys
Thu 13:09

you're not
Tracey Thu 13:09

We are good guys
Thu 13:10

came out today trying to negotiate for us all to win
Wash Thu 13:10

Thank you, Mal. I will now unconditionally support you in these trying times for your kindness.
Tracey Thu 13:10

and the vamps to lose
Thu 13:10

Mal is one of the few people talking sense
Thu 13:11

river - i'm interested in what you would do in my position?
Thu 13:11

you seem to think that we're doing this wrong
Wash Thu 13:11

And I take it Badger is a Vampire according to the Illuminati.
River Thu 13:11

I think todays "negotiations" jeopardize my win-
Tracey Thu 13:11

tell us the right way according to you
Thu 13:11

what you do as illu in our position
River Thu 13:12

I don't have to.
Thu 13:12

So your problem.
Operative Thu 13:12

I don't see the point in being a sub faction and playing as if you win with village win condition. There's no point in sub factions otherwise. Might aswell all be masons
Tracey Thu 13:12

Right so you're saying "You're doing it wrong" but are not able to say how to do it right, so we can safely ignore your opinion
Thu 13:12

Good stuff
River Thu 13:12

I think this game is balanced on some subfaction being a dick
Thu 13:12

and I think you just "balanced" the game
Mal Thu 13:12

RIght now, we have 2 subfactions (Inq and Ilu) who both want to kill vamps, but "not quite yet" - which is reasonable. That's 7 people that we know of so far. If we assume 2 vamps with 2 alive recruits each (we've seen 2 dead Fams right?), that's another 4 people who don't want to kill vamps. that's over 50% of the village...
Thu 13:13

For the rest of us, if we can get those 2 sub-factions on side, we have a better chance.
Tracey Thu 13:13

i couldnt agree more mal
Mal Thu 13:13

So it's not as easy as "kill the vamps, fuck off the subfactions" - we (in theory) don't have the numbers to do that.
River Thu 13:14

yeah but we can force subfactions into playing for us
Thu 13:14

"gentle force"
Tracey Thu 13:14

we are not able to vote for vamps until our other conditions are met
Thu 13:14

we lose if we dont so there's no way you can force us
River Thu 13:14

we're at MAD again
Tracey Thu 13:14

like what's worse than losing? Nothing.
Mal Thu 13:14

Ilu have already given us a way of getting them on-side - kill a mason
Thu 13:14

Inq have given us a way - I purify some people
River Thu 13:15

I wont ever comply to that
Mal Thu 13:15

these are both pretty reasonable requests
Tracey Thu 13:15

Why not if it means you win, river?
River Thu 13:15

if you work against me I'll vote oyu
Thu 13:15

this is also true for deal mal
Thu 13:15

*dear
Thu 13:15

If you purify the GV I'm happy to lynch you
Mal Thu 13:15

Purifying still gives us parity options, it's better than the inq voting against the village, or making use of jayne to kill people
Tracey Thu 13:15

Right so in other words, you're useless to the village because the village need the inq and illu votes
Mal Thu 13:16

Your option seems to be to just kill villagers?
River Thu 13:16

It's politics :)
Tracey Thu 13:16

so if you're threatenting that then what use are you to the village?
Wash Thu 13:16

Anyone want my vote? Up for sale.
River Thu 13:16

I can get masons to vote YOU out
Thu 13:16

same the other way
Moderator Thu 13:16

Jayne votes to lynch Badger
Tracey Thu 13:16

right but the masons can work with us as well
Thu 13:16

we just need one alive at the end
Mal Thu 13:16

Wash: I think badger for now, but I know that doesn't sit well with the inq
Operative Thu 13:16

Masons dont have to
Mal Thu 13:17

erm, ilu *
Operative Thu 13:17

The numbers
River Thu 13:17

yeah but why should I bow in front of you when I can just use the other factions to force you into submission of the greater good
Wash Thu 13:17

Surely the subfactions have more of a investment in the village winning than the Vampires, *even if* they do not end up winning in the end.
Tracey Thu 13:17

you cant force us, we will lose if we dont do this
Operative Thu 13:17

But you can't. Because you're against all factions except masons
Tracey Thu 13:17

so there's nothing you can do that can force us
River Thu 13:17

I can make us lose :)
Tracey Thu 13:17

Wash it's not a "half win"
Mal Thu 13:17

Wash: I disagree to a degree. if they lose regardless, it doesn't strictly matter who wins
Wash Thu 13:17

It is in your heart.
Tracey Thu 13:18

river: then the village is better killing you than anyone else if you're willing to do that - as bad as a vamp
River Thu 13:18

I think you made this game way harder today
Thu 13:18

you did a huge disservice
Tracey Thu 13:18

You need to get over your childish personal gripes and work with us to figure out a way for the whole village to win
Operative Thu 13:18

It was already harder. We always needed do kill the masons
Tracey Thu 13:18

masons, illu, inq and plain
Mal Thu 13:18

And I'd say the inq/ilu are more likely to be want a non-village win than a village-but-not-them win as a way to encourage a village-and-them win.
Operative Thu 13:18

Yeah we can all win
River Thu 13:19

no we cant
Operative Thu 13:19

Mal is very reasonable
Tracey Thu 13:19

I dont see it either way - vamp win or plain village win are both me losing
Operative Thu 13:19

River is not
Wash Thu 13:19

Countdown until the Vamp alliance?
Tracey Thu 13:19

do vamps need to kill other vamps?
Mal Thu 13:19

Yes, we can - purify some W/C, kill all-but-one mason, it's very doable.
Wash Thu 13:19

Yes.
Mal Thu 13:19

Tracey: yes
Jayne Thu 13:19

I am not inq don't bring me into this. (and I still want to know why I am not)
Tracey Thu 13:19

Definitely Mal
Thu 13:20

We can use recruit again on sunday to confirm another villager
Operative Thu 13:20

I'm glad we have villagers willing to compromise
Tracey Thu 13:20

and we have power roles that can find vamps
Operative Thu 13:20

Which are none magic
Wash Thu 13:20

These roles being?
Mal Thu 13:21

I honestly want Inq to recruit River.
Thu 13:21

For banter reasons.
Wash Thu 13:21

I need to update my notes.
Operative Thu 13:21

Yeah that'd be funny
River Thu 13:21

why is it "childish" if I don't agree with you
Tracey Thu 13:21

Wash I am stalker, we have lookout also
Thu 13:21

the way you act is childish River
Wash Thu 13:21

I see.
Operative Thu 13:21

Because you're fighting with villagers who all want the village to win
River Thu 13:21

Why?
Simon Thu 13:21

Wash what is your claim? Jayne I said I would look to recruit when I had another recruit to use. I'm all out atm until the refresh.
River Thu 13:21

you fight with village too
Tracey Thu 13:21

"I will tank this game so you dont win"
Wash Thu 13:21

That's a big secret.
Operative Thu 13:21

Just you actually
Tracey Thu 13:21

we are not fighting the village
Thu 13:21

we are the village
Thu 13:22

thats what you dont seem to get
Simon Thu 13:22

Wash, Claim
Mal Thu 13:22

Simon: can you confirm that you have an as-yet-unnamed 3rd recruit, and if they are alive?
Wash Thu 13:22

BIG SECRET THO
Simon Thu 13:22

That is what I have been saying and will continue to say Mal
Thu 13:22

Wash just claim already
Monty Thu 13:23

no
Mal Thu 13:23

That's fine, just wanted to be sure I had the right end of the stick :)
Wash Thu 13:23

I'm an actual real Vanilla.
Simon Thu 13:23

Lolz
Monty Thu 13:23

0h is iy
Tracey Thu 13:23

We have those? Christ.
Thu 13:23

actual vanilla
Operative Thu 13:23

Sure it isn't a vanilla that becomes ML?
Wash Thu 13:23

Real ones too.
Monty Thu 13:23

is it
Operative Thu 13:23

Check discord
Simon Thu 13:23

Monty? What?
Wash Thu 13:24

It's a Vanilla that becomes a Chosen One on Sunday, obviously.
Monty Thu 13:24

Wait..
Thu 13:24

SOMEONE TYPING ON MY LAPPY
Operative Thu 13:24

Hopefully you'll join illu
Tracey Thu 13:24

Monty what are you doing?
Operative Thu 13:24

Lol
Monty Thu 13:24

I was confused when I talk...
Wash Thu 13:24

I am not partisan.
Operative Thu 13:24

Wtf
Tracey Thu 13:24

puppet confirmed
Simon Thu 13:25

Monty control yourselves
Operative Thu 13:25

Are you ok Monty?
Mal Thu 13:25

Monty is broken
River Thu 13:25

I dont understand why Illu's don't understand if they do politics which could harm me.
Monty Thu 13:25

My lappy is upstairs. I'm lazy to go and scold my cousin.
Thu 13:25

Anyway. Ignore any weird msj.
Operative Thu 13:26

What is harmful about us all discussing how we can work together so everyone wins
Simon Thu 13:26

What was your claim again Monty?
Monty Thu 13:26

I'm trying to read here. What the big topic?
Operative Thu 13:26

Militia
Monty Thu 13:26

I'm Militia.
Operative Thu 13:26

Shot patience
Simon Thu 13:27

Ah yes
Wash Thu 13:27

I'm off to have a shower.
Operative Thu 13:27

You should WASH
Monty Thu 13:28

Me too
Wash Thu 13:28

Me too.
Thu 13:28

You as well?
Monty Thu 13:28

Yes.
Wash Thu 13:28

And me.
Monty Thu 13:28

I need a shower too
Thu 13:28

Just back from work ^^
Wash Thu 13:28

I also need one.
Operative Thu 13:28

You smell
Monty Thu 13:29

I'm not. Let's not shitposting.
Wash Thu 13:29

It would appear we have the same goals.
Monty Thu 13:29

I have too much text to read already.
Thu 13:29

Wash. Seem like that ^^
Simon Thu 13:30

Wash were you a drunk?
MrUniverse Thu 13:30

Well, this seems like one hell of a party
Wash Thu 13:30

No.
River Thu 13:30

It's very easy: The optimal play for village is to give us both vamp checks, everything else is suboptimal and reduces my chances of winning.
Tracey Thu 13:30

but we are not *just* village
Thu 13:30

so that is not optimal for us
Thu 13:31

we can all win this if we change our thinking from sub-factions and village to a single mega team of plain-mason-illu-inq
Thu 13:31

vs vamps
Wash Thu 13:31

Mark says I'm actually a VM and can't figure out why I haven't done anything at night.
River Thu 13:31

this is so hypocritical coming from you
Tracey Thu 13:31

It's really not, it's what I was asking for from the start
Simon Thu 13:31

Hey MrU what did you do last night?
MrUniverse Thu 13:32

Nothing
River Thu 13:32

Let's do more politics
MrUniverse Thu 13:32

There was talking of holding of shooting, so I did
Operative Thu 13:33

Hello MrU
MrUniverse Thu 13:33

It looked like a big confusing mess at the end
Thu 13:33

Also, hi
Operative Thu 13:33

We are discussing trying to make sure everyone wins (not vamps obvs)
Wash Thu 13:33

Tracey, have you given your stalks?
MrUniverse Thu 13:33

Seems reasonable
Tracey Thu 13:34

I have no given all of them
MrUniverse Thu 13:34

I can help in that regard
Tracey Thu 13:34

I have one which reveals a vampire
Thu 13:34

Which I am happy to give
Thu 13:34

but I need to feel like illu objectives are going to be completed
Wash Thu 13:34

And it's a negotiating tool.
Operative Thu 13:34

I think in the spirit of cooperation we will give the vamp tomorrow? They can't go anywhere
Thu 13:34

We gave one today
MrUniverse Thu 13:34

I could shoot Niska, help the illuminati, since they seem to have gotten screwed over massively
Mal Thu 13:34

MrUniverse could shoot niska.
MrUniverse Thu 13:34

Jinx
Mal Thu 13:34

(which is exactly what he just said!)
Operative Thu 13:34

Thanks MrU
Tracey Thu 13:35

I dont want to have to negotiate, i'd rather we all just work together
Thu 13:35

we;re all against vamps
Simon Thu 13:35

Tracey can you give us your checks that don't lead to vamps?
Operative Thu 13:35

That seems reasonable
Tracey Thu 13:36

yes so N2 Fanty visited nobody
Thu 13:36

And N3 sherrif visted fanty
Simon Thu 13:36

You sure?
MrUniverse Thu 13:36

Erm...
Operative Thu 13:36

Have there been 3/4 nights
Tracey Thu 13:36

Pretty sure let me check my days
Wash Thu 13:36

hmm hmm hmm
MrUniverse Thu 13:37

We've had 4 nights
Thu 13:37

We're on day 5
Tracey Thu 13:38

N1 <secret>, N2 Fanty did not visit anyone, N3 Lenore visted Fanty, then N4 sherrif did
Thu 13:38

sorry missed a night
River Thu 13:38

why shoot niska?
Tracey Thu 13:38

niska is either dodgy or it helps illu get to only 1 mason, so we can start killing vamps outright
River Thu 13:38

sorry if we start shooting villagers I'm out.
Thu 13:38

KNOWLINGLY
Tracey Thu 13:38

we cant start doing that until this other objective is complete
Thu 13:39

they could be dodgy
Operative Thu 13:39

River you're voting for a villager
Thu 13:39

So
Tracey Thu 13:39

this backup ML claim is sus AF
River Thu 13:39

So obviously you alwo want to shoot Sheriff and the MW
Thu 13:39

great
Tracey Thu 13:39

not immediately
River Thu 13:39

very sensible of you
Tracey Thu 13:39

but at some point before the end of the game we need one of them dead
Operative Thu 13:39

Its a balance
Tracey Thu 13:39

and for there not to be any more, obviously
Thu 13:40

once we have achieved that we can focus on vamps 100% - which is more roles and people working towards your goal
River Thu 13:40

focusing on evil last sounds very sensible. NOT
Tracey Thu 13:40

whether you like it or not, getting the other factions on side and happy is a secondary objective for plain town
Thu 13:40

as they wont win without the sub factions
River Thu 13:41

we can win without you
Operative Thu 13:41

River joining a sub faction would be so funny to watch
Tracey Thu 13:41

at some point you're going to start needing our votes
River Thu 13:41

like we'll need niska's vote
Thu 13:41

so that's a moot point
Tracey Thu 13:41

niska may well be evil
Thu 13:41

ridiculous claim yesterday
River Thu 13:41

that from your mouth has absolutley no value
Operative Thu 13:41

River does not understand multiple objectives
River Thu 13:41

nothing person
Thu 13:42

al
Operative Thu 13:42

Like seriously
Tracey Thu 13:42

it is personal but okay
River Thu 13:42

you want to start shooting villagers at 20 peeps
Thu 13:42

that's ridicolous
Tracey Thu 13:42

i want niska who is possibly not a villager
Operative Thu 13:42

You're being ridiculous. We have three sub factions that make up almost half the town
River Thu 13:42

that's your little narrative
Operative Thu 13:42

We have found 2 vampires
Thu 13:42

We are not losing to vamps
River Thu 13:43

Confidence is an insidious killer
Operative Thu 13:43

River you need to work with people who have more than one objective to win
Tracey Thu 13:43

You are much more likely to win with us, than against us
River Thu 13:43

yeah but I can just work with masons
Tracey Thu 13:43

And likewise from our point of view
River Thu 13:43

and do the same
Operative Thu 13:43

You cant
Thu 13:43

Because there's only 4 of you
River Thu 13:43

why? masons got no second objective
Thu 13:44

So easy to work with them
Operative Thu 13:44

If you attack sub factions you can't beat them with the masons
Tracey Thu 13:44

It's in the best interest of the inquisition to do what we are doing
Thu 13:44

as they are in the same position we are
Operative Thu 13:44

Because evil will also get involved
River Thu 13:44

and they'll vote with me :)
Thu 13:44

he he
Operative Thu 13:44

Only 4 votes
Tracey Thu 13:44

and you'll lose the game?
Operative Thu 13:44

I repeat
River Thu 13:44

why only 4?
Simon Thu 13:45

Okay so say Niska is shot and then dug as fam we find that Sheriff and Fanty are also evil. That's a big gain. If dug as plain villager it's not like we lose a power role. I can certainly understand the logic.
Operative Thu 13:45

You plus 3 masons
River Thu 13:45

plus 6? evils
Thu 13:45

that's parity
Operative Thu 13:45

I agree Simon
Thu 13:46

River if you start going after inq and illu, then we can't outvote you
Thu 13:46

Can
Thu 13:46

**
River Thu 13:46

You wanna play games, I can play that game too.
Thu 13:46

:>
Tracey Thu 13:46

We dont want to play games, thats the point
River Thu 13:46

you're just now doing it
Operative Thu 13:46

You're more harmful to village than we are lol
Tracey Thu 13:46

we are trying to find a way for all factions to win
River Thu 13:46

except masons
Tracey Thu 13:46

yeah river is toxic
Thu 13:46

No we want masons to win as well
Thu 13:46

they are town
River Thu 13:46

oh common stop that "toxic" shit.
Thu 13:47

You poisoned the well, not me.
Operative Thu 13:47

River is acting like she's a mason
Thu 13:47

Y'know they might not agree with you right?
River Thu 13:47

which math tells you I'm not
Operative Thu 13:48

It's in everyone's interests to win. So keeping sub factions happy whilst killing evils is a win win
Tracey Thu 13:48

River Thu 10:20 f off tracey Thu 10:20 just shut it and go
Operative Thu 13:48

I don't see what you don't get about that
Tracey Thu 13:48

^ not toxic?
River Thu 13:48

You can handle it boy, can you?
Tracey Thu 13:48

Just unpleasant all day, for no reason
River Thu 13:48

You shooting niska
Thu 13:48

I don't get
Operative Thu 13:49

Simon explained it well I think
Thu 13:49

Also illu want masons so
River Thu 13:49

I wont submit to your requests. I play the game as villager. Not as slave.
Operative Thu 13:49

Cool
Tracey Thu 13:49

okay well we dont need you if the rest of the town will work with us
River Thu 13:49

You try to force village into shooting a probable villager
Tracey Thu 13:50

and the rest of the town should because we want everyone to win
Operative Thu 13:50

We aren't forcing anyone to do anything
River Thu 13:50

so we get your second vamp right?
Tracey Thu 13:50

of course, i want that vamp to die
River Thu 13:50

no you wont
Thu 13:50

you'll delay this even more
Thu 13:50

I know you
Tracey Thu 13:50

I dont want the vamp to die?
Thu 13:50

you dont know me
Thu 13:50

but okay
Thu 13:50

your logic makes no sense
Operative Thu 13:50

We already gave you a vamp
River Thu 13:51

if you out the vamp tomorrow, and the number of fams we killed, you fear it may be over too soon, before you can get rid of masons
Operative Thu 13:51

Who you still aren't voting for
Tracey Thu 13:51

Correct I will not get this vamp until our objective is safely met
River Thu 13:51

see
Tracey Thu 13:51

just as im sure the inquisiton wont
River Thu 13:51

you're even admitting to keep us hanging until you got your goal.
Tracey Thu 13:51

but what we are saying is, rather than this all being done in secret and stabbing in the back we do it in the open
Operative Thu 13:51

What's wrong with that
Tracey Thu 13:52

We help the inq get what they need, we help us get what we need
Operative Thu 13:52

Someone put river in a faction
River Thu 13:52

you fuck up my game :)
Operative Thu 13:52

Jesus Christ
Tracey Thu 13:52

then we kill vamps
Thu 13:52

and win
Operative Thu 13:52

Does not understand at all
Tracey Thu 13:52

otherwise if it's all done in secret then people will stab each other in the back, which is only good for vamps
Thu 13:52

we need to act as one village team with multiple objectives
Mal Thu 13:52

River: masons still win with the village even if all-but-one are dead.
Tracey Thu 13:52

whether you like it or not, our objectives kind of become yours
Mal Thu 13:53

So killing a mason isn't stopping them winning
Tracey Thu 13:53

We just want to work openly and secure a village win
Thu 13:53

absolutely - and if we had any magic users left in our team, we would sacrifice them as the inq need that to win
Thu 13:53

as long as the inq help us achieve our goal and the ultimate goal of getting vamps
Thu 13:54

if we all just put our cards on the table we can work this out so all village win, including masons
River Thu 13:54

No, this sets a precedent for toxic village games.
Tracey Thu 13:54

In what way?
Operative Thu 13:54

I'm gonna laugh so much if river is a fam
River Thu 13:54

in your risking the game
Tracey Thu 13:54

I dont think we are, we are providing a more secure way to win
Thu 13:54

we will have massive group of known village
Thu 13:54

and can easily pick off the vamps
River Thu 13:54

not for long
Thu 13:55

which I'm looking forward to
Thu 13:55

I hope the last of you will have the dignity to give the check.
Tracey Thu 13:55

Well we are going to enagge with the village who are willing to do this
Thu 13:55

you dont have to join but you're working against your own team if they go along with us
Operative Thu 13:55

Yeah everyone except river is being cooperative
River Thu 13:55

I play for the greater good long term, you crossed the rubicon, so you gonna die.
Tracey Thu 13:55

yeah okay
Thu 13:56

river is a lost cause
Operative Thu 13:56

Yup lol
Tracey Thu 13:56

i'm going to focus my efforts elsewhere
River Thu 13:57

No checks from me
Simon Thu 13:57

So just need to know what Zoe is now
Thu 13:57

I'm guessing Op is the illu leader
Thu 13:58

DrCaron needs to sober up
River Thu 13:58

If jubal doesn't watch the watchout, and the watchout dies, I'll give my check
Mal Thu 13:58

wha?
Operative Thu 13:58

What
River Thu 13:58

if one of the illus dies, I'll give my checks :)
Simon Thu 13:58

The lookout you mean?
Operative Thu 13:59

Lol great
Mal Thu 13:59

There is no village benefit to Ilu dying..
River Thu 13:59

there is no village benefit in shooting masons
Mal Thu 13:59

Killing 1 mason gets us 3 on-side votes.
River Thu 13:59

every thought they could be BLUFFING?
Thu 13:59

think about it.
Mal Thu 13:59

They want to win with us..
Thu 13:59

They can't win without the village winning...
Simon Thu 14:00

If vamps listen to River then surely they don't kill the Illu lookout to stop us knowing a check...
River Thu 14:00

there are multiple basements
Operative Thu 14:00

Jubal should be on lookout tonight
River Thu 14:00

Honestly I start to think they don't have a second vamp check
Operative Thu 14:00

To make sure we catch an evil of they kill her
River Thu 14:00

how would they have it anyway
Tracey Thu 14:00

My N1 check is a vamp
River Thu 14:01

how? :=
Thu 14:01

you got no seer :P
Tracey Thu 14:01

I know who visited book, who was dug as fam
River Thu 14:01

that's not n1
Mal Thu 14:01

Look, Nandi went off-script for them and gave us one of the 2 checks, so they've (as a collective) shown us some faith by giving us 1/2, so it's fair for us to show them some faith in return
River Thu 14:01

you lied
Thu 14:01

ha ha
Thu 14:01

if you bluff get your checks straight :P
Thu 14:01

the silence...
Wash Thu 14:01

REVEALED: Two people visited Book, Tracey on suicide watch.
River Thu 14:01

delicious
Operative Thu 14:01

He never gave his n1 checj
River Thu 14:02

yeah but brook died n2 not 1 :P
Thu 14:02

so he fucked up
Operative Thu 14:02

No
MrUniverse Thu 14:02

Book got lynched
Monty Thu 14:02

D3
MrUniverse Thu 14:02

He was a fam
Operative Thu 14:02

He saw the fam get recruited you moron
MrUniverse Thu 14:02

^that
Monty Thu 14:02

-_-
Tracey Thu 14:02

Anything to say about that river?
River Thu 14:02

Moron^^ T O X I C :D
Tracey Thu 14:02

No?
Thu 14:02

Okay good.
River Thu 14:02

You're C A N C E R
Mal Thu 14:02

We all believe book was recruited N1, so knowing who visited him is a good lead on the vamp.
River Thu 14:03

*memes*
Simon Thu 14:03

Mr U it's ultimately your choice to shoot
Tracey Thu 14:03

basically confirms the vamp
Mal Thu 14:03

Presumably it's not someone who has given any other role that might suggest they're not a vamp
Thu 14:03

so it's a good lead
Monty Thu 14:03

why Tracy still hold his check?
River Thu 14:03

honestly, we probably gonna lynch that dude before we even need that check
MrUniverse Thu 14:03

Well, might as well try to help everyone win
Mal Thu 14:03

Monty: Because they want some playing cards to encourage us to kill a mason
Monty Thu 14:04

Go fuck yourself
Operative Thu 14:04

Lol
MrUniverse Thu 14:04

Wow
Monty Thu 14:04

I will lynch you first
Mal Thu 14:04

It's a fair and reasonable play
Simon Thu 14:04

Mr U is going to shoot Niska. Can you now tell us the other vamp?
Operative Thu 14:04

Crazy guy
Mal Thu 14:04

There is no incentive for MrU to actually shoot niska tonight if they give the check now, I imagine they won't
Monty Thu 14:04

If I known I hold my check just to shot you tonight.
Thu 14:05

VM might have 2 more recruit.
Thu 14:05

Why would you risk it?
Operative Thu 14:05

We are killing a vamp today
Moderator Thu 14:05

Wash votes to lynch Badger
Operative Thu 14:05

All illu know the vamp. There isn't a risk. All of us would have to die for us to not share that
Monty Thu 14:05

I'm gonna go read the game that I missed.
Wash Thu 14:05

I realise I haven't voted yet.
Mal Thu 14:06

Monty: Ilu don't win if there are more than 1 masons alive, they want to win
Thu 14:06

There is no benefit to them of a village win if the masons are all still alive
Simon Thu 14:06

Tracey, did you see my question?
Moderator Thu 14:06

MrUniverse votes to lynch Badger
Mal Thu 14:06

So they want to (rightfully so) thin the masons out a bit, and gating their check behind that
Monty Thu 14:06

Well Village can lost with shity illu play then
Operative Thu 14:07

I think we need to hold the check for leverage so MW doesn't eat us
Monty Thu 14:07

Pffft.
MrUniverse Thu 14:07

Well, it sounds like with the badger lynch, we will have 3 evils down?
Mal Thu 14:07

It's not shitty ILU play, it's sensible from their PoV.
Thu 14:07

As I said before, they'll probably want a non-village win if tehy can't get a village+ilu win
Wash Thu 14:08

Madness.
River Thu 14:08

Getting called a moron, but I'm soo toxic ...
Monty Thu 14:08

Well, if we have Vampire without Wolves that means we have more than one Vampire.
Tracey Thu 14:08

you literally told me to fuck off before
MrUniverse Thu 14:08

Assuming 1vm, then the illuminati already have that one in their sights
River Thu 14:08

Operative don't be childish and call others morons ok?
Simon Thu 14:08

Fanty doesn't want to eat you he wants to help the village
MrUniverse Thu 14:08

If there is another, then this probably another 4?
Monty Thu 14:08

They win with village if village win
Operative Thu 14:08

I shouldn't have insulted you, I'm sorry
Simon Thu 14:08

The only way Fanty kills you is if he is now fam
River Thu 14:08

Tracey you hold the game hostage.
Mal Thu 14:08

(And to point out, because a lot of people are focused on the ilu - the inq also right now don't want to just lynch all the vamps because they also lose until Higgins and Stitch are cleansed of their magic)
Monty Thu 14:08

They just have extra win with no Mason
Simon Thu 14:09

Mason don't need Illu dead
River Thu 14:09

@Operative, obviously the TOXIC/Canter is a meme from another game. I don't agree with you but obviously youre not.
Wash Thu 14:09

What was Stitch again?
Mal Thu 14:09

Monty: they do not win with the village unless their other condition is met
MrUniverse Thu 14:09

Stitch says gv
Mal Thu 14:09

Wash: gv who didn't revive Kaylee n2.
Monty Thu 14:09

Really?
Operative Thu 14:09

I'm not what?
Wash Thu 14:09

Oh yeah, that guy.
Monty Thu 14:09

Then they get msj. YOU LOST ILLU
Thu 14:09

Like that?
River Thu 14:09

Toxic/Cancer, the meme I posted above :P
Operative Thu 14:10

Ah ok
River Thu 14:10

Still odn't agree
Thu 14:10

sorry about the fuck off, but it's a HARD slap in the face tracey
Mal Thu 14:10

Monty: The game tracks winners (it may not publish it anywhere, but if you look at the archive you can see lists of winners on games)
Monty Thu 14:10

River what side you are in?
Mal Thu 14:10

they don't count as winning without meeting both win conditions
River Thu 14:10

I'm village but I feel slapped so hard since illu are keeping the game hostage.
Simon Thu 14:10

So as you're not getting eaten and the masons will be reduced in number can you tell us the other vamp now please?
River Thu 14:11

we basically could have won by NOW
Tracey Thu 14:11

we are trying to work together with you
Thu 14:11

YOU could have but WE couldnt
Monty Thu 14:11

Well, we can let Vampire lurk freely
Thu 14:11

And let the evils win
Tracey Thu 14:11

so to get to this quick win, help us win and then we can
River Thu 14:11

dude, I type here for days and you have TWO VAMPS
Tracey Thu 14:11

we only got the second one last night
River Thu 14:11

QUICK is when you'd have told us about the book recruit day 3.
Monty Thu 14:11

When we exactly sure that illu is lit again?
River Thu 14:12

We're on day 5 and you tell us day 3
SheriffBourne Thu 14:12

I've skimmed over some of the later parts
Tracey Thu 14:12

day 3 we were about the lynch a possible mason, of course i want that
Mal Thu 14:12

River: they're not keeping it hostage, we have a vamp to lynch today because of them.
SheriffBourne Thu 14:12

but I'm here to crash the party
River Thu 14:12

they're wasting my time
Monty Thu 14:12

How we know that they are not Vamire?
Tracey Thu 14:12

and we are happy to give other vamp
River Thu 14:12

yeah day 11
Thu 14:12

top kek
Tracey Thu 14:12

well the day are win is secured
Monty Thu 14:12

This game wasting my time
Tracey Thu 14:12

*our
SheriffBourne Thu 14:12

Masons have the objective to have no Illuminati standing. So there's no happy ending with all Illuminati and one Mason.
Thu 14:12

This is a fight to the death.
Monty Thu 14:12

I need to re-read the game
River Thu 14:12

no they dont
Tracey Thu 14:12

masons do not have that
SheriffBourne Thu 14:13

They do this game.
Tracey Thu 14:13

masons only want to win
Monty Thu 14:13

And all of them just illu bitching their win?
SheriffBourne Thu 14:13

That's what I state now, and you will assume it's in my role description.
Tracey Thu 14:13

what are you talking about?
SheriffBourne Thu 14:13

Or assume I'm lying about it in its entirety.
Tracey Thu 14:13

you win if we win sherrif, if you're willing to work with us
Operative Thu 14:13

Masons don't need to kill illu
Tracey Thu 14:13

even the dead masons
SheriffBourne Thu 14:14

You think you know 296-Masons, but you don't.
Monty Thu 14:14

I think I lost some of my IQ
SheriffBourne Thu 14:14

It's the kind of Masons that need Illuminati dead. Special edition.
Tracey Thu 14:14

We can only work off the HTP
SheriffBourne Thu 14:14

Well, that stuff ended yesterday with Niska already.
Tracey Thu 14:14

Which I dont fully believe
Operative Thu 14:14

Also @River you think you've been slapped in the face? Imagine being illu and 2 masons sober up with a potential for 3 ML
MrUniverse Thu 14:14

So, I feel like these masons look more like vamps the longer this game goes on
SheriffBourne Thu 14:14

I'm unwilling to go meta, that's why I say it's in my role description.
Simon Thu 14:15

Agreed MrU
Operative Thu 14:15

So masons are lying about their objective???
Simon Thu 14:15

Happy to see them dead if that's the case
Tracey Thu 14:15

so what you're saying is you want it to be Mason v Illu and illu know both vamps
SheriffBourne Thu 14:15

It wasn't necessary to state this explicitly before, but now that Illuminati wants to trade Masons for their power it is.
Operative Thu 14:15

WHAT
Thu 14:15

How many rules are you guys gonna make up
Wash Thu 14:16

This gets better and better.
SheriffBourne Thu 14:16

I still have a recruit, and I will use it in my political interests.
Thu 14:16

A Mason-Inquisition allegiance seems nice.
Monty Thu 14:16

Can we revived Mason Leader in GY please?
SheriffBourne Thu 14:16

We will also hunt witchcraft users if you stand on the Mason side here
Operative Thu 14:16

This is crazy
Tracey Thu 14:16

We can make that same promise, except we know the vamps
Operative Thu 14:16

Masons don't need illu dead
Simon Thu 14:17

*claps* well played Mark, well played
Monty Thu 14:17

I thought we play to find evils?
Thu 14:17

No?
Tracey Thu 14:17

and yes i dont believe the game has been re-written for this
Wash Thu 14:17

lynch masons lynch masons
Thu 14:17

wee woo wee woo
SheriffBourne Thu 14:17

Monty Thu 14:17 I thought we play to find evils? <=== we've passed on from this
Operative Thu 14:17

Like this ML saying I need to kill illu when they didn't even think illu existed yesterday
Thu 14:17

PAL LEASE
Thu 14:18

Such a joke
SheriffBourne Thu 14:18

I said that I wasn't entirely convinced there were Illu because it seemed like a nice gap to be filled by a basement
Thu 14:18

In light of current evidence, the Illu lookout and all, I've changed my views
Simon Thu 14:18

We will discuss this evening and get back to you. If *anyone* strikes down a member of the inquisition, knowingly or otherwise, we will side against you.
Moderator Thu 14:18

Monty votes to lynch Badger
Operative Thu 14:18

Your role specifically says kill illu and you think they aren't around?
Thu 14:18

These masons are bs
Wash Thu 14:19

First the "vanilla but actually mason", and now apparently this.
MrUniverse Thu 14:19

Yet another brick onto their ever evolving story
Tracey Thu 14:19

Their role which isnt in the HTP and we only have their word on it
Wash Thu 14:19

My trust is falling quite fast, really.
SheriffBourne Thu 14:19

All I know is that Illuminati, if they exist, must die in order for the Masons to become victorious.
Mal Thu 14:19

I mean, we can lynch both masons and illu if that's needed and then both win.
SheriffBourne Thu 14:19

You're twisting my words, Operative.
Wash Thu 14:19

Throw checks at em.
SheriffBourne Thu 14:19

I never said that my job description implies there MUST be illuminati.
Simon Thu 14:19

Now you're thinking my language Mal!
SheriffBourne Thu 14:19

It just says they CAN'T be if I want to win.
Operative Thu 14:20

So why would that be added if illu didn't exist
Thu 14:20

It isn't in h2p
SheriffBourne Thu 14:20

I'm quite sure rest of the village doesn't want to waste resources on Mason-Inquisition fights, we have the common enemy of the Vampire.
Mal Thu 14:20

(I don't believe the masons require illu to die, I think that's just SheriffBourne not wanting us to shoot Niska)
Operative Thu 14:20

So do we
Thu 14:20

Masons are full of it
Tracey Thu 14:20

I think that too Mal, but we are quite prepared to work with masons and inq
Thu 14:20

apparently they are not with us
Operative Thu 14:20

Tbh don't even believe they are masons
Monty Thu 14:21

If they required each other to lost, let's just keep them all life. So both of them lost. Happy ending.
Operative Thu 14:21

Masons are making up rules all over the place
SheriffBourne Thu 14:21

Operative, not sure what you expect here. I think you can reason for yourself that this game is outside of normal parameters. Look at Niska's story, look at what I say. This involves moderator stuff. I can't prove this like you want because it goes against rules.
Thu 14:21

So I must stick to claiming things and not being able to back it up, or get smited.
Thu 14:22

So fuck you for setting unrealistic and hypocritical standards for this game.
Mal Thu 14:22

Right now I think the masons are the least-trustworthy of the subfactions anyway, so if we have to pick sides then I'd be ok with inq+ilu over masons.
Wash Thu 14:22

I am of the opinion that the Masons are not Masons.
River Thu 14:22

I'm out of this. Apparently Illu can end the game by themselves. So I see it as a complete waste of time to put my own time into this game.
Operative Thu 14:22

Masons don't need illu to die
Thu 14:22

And the made up Niska shit yesterday
Monty Thu 14:22

I don't think it fair to CHANGE RULE CONDITION suddenly. Mark won't make those unnecessary conflict.
Tracey Thu 14:22

I feel like I'm wasting my time with ext games if this is how they are run - random objectives and roles added, not documented anywhere just on a whim because they look like one side is losing and it's not how the mod wanted the game to go?
Operative Thu 14:22

Oh boy
River Thu 14:22

You got it solved
Thu 14:22

why should I do anything
Tracey Thu 14:23

Great river, we prefer if you do nothing
SheriffBourne Thu 14:23

@Mal: that's what you think now, but you might think otherwise tomorrow. If you recruit.
Operative Thu 14:23

He didn't. Masons are lying
River Thu 14:23

Sorry this is just a huge slap in everyone's not illu's face.
SheriffBourne Thu 14:23

@MrU: shooting Mason seems like a good idea tomorrow, but you might think otherwise t omorrow. If you get recruited
MrUniverse Thu 14:23

If rather you didnt
SheriffBourne Thu 14:23

I want to maximize the political value of this last recruit that I have.
MrUniverse Thu 14:23

*I
River Thu 14:24

And if you don't see why this is slap in the face, maybe you should do it the other way around and think "how would you feel as non subfaction villager"
Operative Thu 14:24

River you think this is fun for the illu?
River Thu 14:24

if you were told that some dudes got the game solved
Operative Thu 14:24

Adding two masons
Mal Thu 14:24

Tracey: "Unknown" roles are a thing (especially in "special" games - think ext-300). But the mod doesn't play favourites.
River Thu 14:24

and I just to wait here and say "yes mam"
Operative Thu 14:24

Who can both be ML
Tracey Thu 14:24

We havent got it solved FOR US river
Thu 14:24

we have it solved for plain village, but we are not plain village
Thu 14:25

and we dont have it "solved" there are obviously fams etc, but we can go a long way to getting there
SheriffBourne Thu 14:25

Idea: I will recruit the Purifier, this will solidify a bond between Masons and Inquisition. The Purifier will both help confirm the Mason is not a basement as it helps clear the village of witchcraft users.
Operative Thu 14:25

The masons are either lying or this setup with drunks just means illu are destined to loss
Simon Thu 14:26

You leave my purifier alone
Operative Thu 14:26

But the with all the bs masons are spouting about new roles and new objectives I'm pretty sure they're lying
Wash Thu 14:26

100%, Operative.
Mal Thu 14:26

SheriffBourne: I'm not so keen on you threatening people with recruitment, but that said, you can recruit me if you want, I still think it's fair to reduce the number of masons to allow the inq to meet their win condition. And if the masons do infact have a new win condition that's not listed anywhere then you can use your MW to facilitate that.
SheriffBourne Thu 14:26

No, Simon. It is OUR purifier. The purifier of the Mason-Inquisiton allegiance
Thu 14:26

=D
Operative Thu 14:27

You forgot WH
Thu 14:27

Why are you so scared sheriff you having a killing role to deal with us?
Simon Thu 14:27

WH is a better one for Masons to claim
Tracey Thu 14:28

If the mod has really added this secret objective you have then the game for illu is already fucked because we came out and said who we were based on the HTP
Thu 14:28

you know who we all are
Simon Thu 14:28

Purifier isn't aligned to us until they are recruited by us
Tracey Thu 14:28

if we had known you have to kill us, we wouldnt have come out
Operative Thu 14:28

Yeah the new rules bs is bs
Thu 14:28

They're vamps
Tracey Thu 14:28

so if the mod has done that, this will be the last ext game i play because im wasting my time
Operative Thu 14:28

Agreed
Thu 14:29

Like you think the drunks would sober up to fuck over illu that much?
SheriffBourne Thu 14:29

I think this game will spark a fruitful discussion about the desirability of new and unknown game elements and manual mod intervention. I will happily discuss this with all of you, and look at it reasonably.
Thu 14:29

I understand you're hurt from your standpoint atm.
River Thu 14:29

what exactly is unknown?
Operative Thu 14:29

It's bs
Tracey Thu 14:29

that apprently masons this game to win have to kill all illu
Operative Thu 14:30

If you both really become masons with a potential for 3 ML that is so BS
Tracey Thu 14:30

this stated by the masons themselves
Operative Thu 14:30

AND that you have to kill us
Monty Thu 14:30

You know what, let's bring Mason down.
Tracey Thu 14:30

secretly told to them by a mod
River Thu 14:30

"What would you do in their shoes"?
Operative Thu 14:30

Like wtf is the point on ilui
Wash Thu 14:30

https://i.imgur.com/PySdNGa.jpg
River Thu 14:30

funny eh?
Tracey Thu 14:30

and they come out with it AFTER we came out as illu
Monty Thu 14:30

Then, let's lynch Wolves.
Operative Thu 14:30

Yup
Monty Thu 14:30

Then lynch illlu.
Thu 14:31

Lynch Vampo.
Operative Thu 14:31

If they are masons illu has been dicked so hard it isn't even funny
Monty Thu 14:31

*sigh*
Operative Thu 14:31

Still leaning toward them lying hoping it isn't true
Tracey Thu 14:31

So for now I'm going to have to go with masons are lying
Monty Thu 14:31

I hope some of the faction is evils.
Tracey Thu 14:31

but if it turns out to be true im just going to get smited i dont care
Thu 14:32

because whats the point
Thu 14:32

days of my time wasted
Operative Thu 14:32

Yip
Wash Thu 14:32

I have very, very little doubt that it is a lie.
MrUniverse Thu 14:32

I'm assuming it's a lie
Operative Thu 14:32

I think it is. Makes sheriff the vamp
MrUniverse Thu 14:32

If it's true, it's utter bs
Tracey Thu 14:32

so we lynch them then
Simon Thu 14:32

Mr U you know what to do
Niska Thu 14:32

Ok, so after I finished eating my banana bread I have to confirm SHeriff.
Moderator Thu 14:32

Tracey votes to lynch SheriffBourne
Niska Thu 14:32

Mason need Illu to die this game.
SheriffBourne Thu 14:32

Hey Niska.
Operative Thu 14:32

Lol ok mate
Niska Thu 14:32

Hi
Monty Thu 14:32

O.o
SheriffBourne Thu 14:32

Strawberry solar system.
Mal Thu 14:32

Maybe MrU can try to kill SheriffBourne rather than Niska? If the kill doesn't go through...
Thu 14:32

?
Wash Thu 14:33

in te re st in g
MrUniverse Thu 14:33

I'd rather my kill land
Mal Thu 14:33

(and if niska isn't lying, they get a new ML anyway, so it's no loss to the masons)
MrUniverse Thu 14:33

And just lynch sheriff
Simon Thu 14:34

I only become a leader when my leader dies sounds an awful lot like a vamp
DrCaron Thu 14:34

it sounds like BS to me
SheriffBourne Thu 14:34

Hey, Caron.
Thu 14:34

What you sobered up to?
DrCaron Thu 14:34

I wish i knew
MrUniverse Thu 14:34

More importantly, if it is true, I don't like it
Tracey Thu 14:34

yes
MrUniverse Thu 14:34

And will demonstrate with action
Mal Thu 14:34

I was willing to believe it because it made the numbers line up (All 4s)
Niska Thu 14:34

MrU by shooting Sheriif you can prove us masons. By shooting me you help evils
Thu 14:35

I'd rather you dont shoot any of us
Tracey Thu 14:35

The email we got at the start of the game mentioned a new mechanic of refreshed abilities but DIDNT mention anything about objectives changed
DrCaron Thu 14:35

did i see someone say there were 2 MWs?
MrUniverse Thu 14:35

Actually, all it would prove is sheriff isn't vamp
Tracey Thu 14:35

why would the mod mention on thing but not another
Operative Thu 14:35

One MW was lying
MrUniverse Thu 14:35

Yes badger claimed mw
Simon Thu 14:35

No Badger is a vamp
Operative Thu 14:35

Yes Tracey
Mal Thu 14:35

Tracey: Mod has been known to not tell us *everything*
DrCaron Thu 14:35

and who was the other?
Niska Thu 14:35

MrU if Sheriff is no vamp then we are lit as masons
MrUniverse Thu 14:36

Sorry forgot the "claimed"
Mal Thu 14:36

"Solved" games are unfun, so some mystery is normal
Simon Thu 14:36

Fanty
MrUniverse Thu 14:36

Unless it was fanty
Tracey Thu 14:36

If they didnt tell us us this then we have been fucked hard and ive wasted my time for the last several days
River Thu 14:36

Can I just rally all non subfactioners to vote someone? :P
Thu 14:36

rebellion of the underpriviliged
MrUniverse Thu 14:36

He got caught killing
DrCaron Thu 14:36

ty MrU
Moderator Thu 14:36

DrCaron votes to lynch Badger
Operative Thu 14:36

Did you sober up?
Monty Thu 14:36

Yes River ^^
DrCaron Thu 14:36

Not yet
SheriffBourne Thu 14:36

Many of you have voiced your dislike of the game mechanics that we're involved with. And you're holding it against us. We didn't make the rules. Can we keep two things separate here: (1) our conflict based on in-game role (such as Mason versus Illuminati), and (2) your annoyance at the role mechancis surrounding the current alleged Masons
MrUniverse Thu 14:36

Your welcome
Simon Thu 14:36

River, you up for killing Masons or Badger?
Tracey Thu 14:37

We just dont believe you sherrif
SheriffBourne Thu 14:37

I feel I'm getting attacked on a lot of (2) whereas you should focus on (1)
River Thu 14:37

Leave me alone
SheriffBourne Thu 14:37

You're mixing them up all the time, Tracey.
Wash Thu 14:37

https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/538/731/0fc.gif
Tracey Thu 14:37

and we're saying IF it is true then we're unhappy
Niska Thu 14:37

we should not have told them that our objectives have changed and just let the mw do his silent work :/
Simon Thu 14:37

Will do River
DrCaron Thu 14:37

requiring a msg from Discord is where I suspend belief
Operative Thu 14:37

Yes, it's too bs to be true and if it is then fuck it. Still killing masons
Tracey Thu 14:37

bu the effect that it's having on the game is, we dont believe you
Thu 14:37

yeah - what if we're not on discord?
Wash Thu 14:37

It would not have been done through Discord, and that's that.
MrUniverse Thu 14:37

Actually, at this point, I'm just going to vote with the illuminati
Moderator Thu 14:37

MrUniverse votes to lynch SheriffBourne
SheriffBourne Thu 14:38

Alright, whatever.
DrCaron Thu 14:38

that type of deviation from normal play would AT THE LEAST warrant a note about it in the email that already contained special considerations
Thu 14:38

so yeah, not buying it
SheriffBourne Thu 14:38

I feel my emotional investment into this game is draining me as well.
Thu 14:38

I'm leaving
Thu 14:38

Good luck, and I'll check back in later
River Thu 14:38

This is a waste of time.
Moderator Thu 14:38

Operative votes to lynch SheriffBourne
SheriffBourne Thu 14:38

need a break
Moderator Thu 14:38

River votes to lynch Badger
Operative Thu 14:39

Can sheriff not see how unbelievable the story is?
Moderator Thu 14:39

Simon votes to lynch SheriffBourne
DrCaron Thu 14:39

Sheriff or Badger?
Simon Thu 14:39

I want to know asap if I need to believe this bull
DrCaron Thu 14:39

Badger was caught killing
Thu 14:39

a clear and present threat
Operative Thu 14:39

We need to know if the masons are lying
DrCaron Thu 14:39

Sheriff so far is just accused of being full of shit
MrUniverse Thu 14:39

He could be a stupid maple
DrCaron Thu 14:40

true
Monty Thu 14:40

Just lynch Badger first
Wash Thu 14:40

I'm crying blood.
Mal Thu 14:40

SheriffBourne wants to save his team, that's understandable
MrUniverse Thu 14:40

Its more believable than this mason bs
Simon Thu 14:40

We need to know about the Sheriff
Operative Thu 14:40

I wish Higgins had checked one of them
River Thu 14:40

well we could just wait a day
Thu 14:40

you know
DrCaron Thu 14:40

Niska was the one with the crazy 'i will become ML if X happens" story
Operative Thu 14:41

They've said they saw eachother at night
River Thu 14:41

Illu will betray us
Niska Thu 14:41

we did
Wash Thu 14:41

Still can.
River Thu 14:41

there is no second vamp
Thu 14:41

in their checks
Thu 14:41

they'll just say "oh well we lied but we're village, we had to win"
Mal Thu 14:41

I don't think they will
Operative Thu 14:41

River are you not sceptical of the masons?
Mal Thu 14:41

or if they do, then fine, but their motives make sense
DrCaron Thu 14:41

Why Sheriff over Niska (if we are after 'mason' blood)?
MrUniverse Thu 14:42

People think Sheriff might be the vamp
Operative Thu 14:42

Think he's the leader
River Thu 14:42

Lynching masons to please illu goes against all belives I have in ww.es
MrUniverse Thu 14:42

As opposed to familiar
Operative Thu 14:42

And recruited Fanty- vamp
River Thu 14:42

this feels so wrong I wont participate.
Monty Thu 14:42

Vampire will kill illu one by one before they can even reveal the check.
DrCaron Thu 14:42

where does that hypothesis coem from?
Thu 14:42

just chat involvment?
Operative Thu 14:42

It isn't to please us. Read up river
Wash Thu 14:42

Killing Illuminati is a 5000IQ move with the lookout, Monty.
Niska Thu 14:42

Operative Fanty can continue killing all Illu while your LO stays alive to prove himself as mw
Thu 14:42

xD
Operative Thu 14:42

I'm aware of that Niska
Monty Thu 14:43

River Thu 14:42 Lynching masons to please illu goes against all belives I have in ww.es
Mal Thu 14:43

Monty: there is 3 of them, without some co-ordinatio between vamps and the MasonWolf they can't kill all 3
Operative Thu 14:43

Also aware if you recruited him he might not be a MW anymore
River Thu 14:43

I say we lynch an illu, so they might have no choice but revealing tomorrow
Monty Thu 14:43

AGREED 66
Thu 14:43

^^
River Thu 14:43

they wont win if vamp wins
Thu 14:43

so if we lynch one, they have to choose
Operative Thu 14:43

I promise you if you lynch an illu we will let vamps win
Moderator Thu 14:43

DrCaron votes to lynch SheriffBourne
River Thu 14:43

lol
Moderator Thu 14:43

Niska votes to lynch Badger
MrUniverse Thu 14:44

No, as far as I'm concerned, either the masons are lying, or the mod screwed over the inquisition hard. Either way, I want to help the illuminati
River Thu 14:44

THEY ARE WASTING OUR TIME GUYS
Monty Thu 14:44

If you let Vamp win that your own lost too
Operative Thu 14:44

The fact river isn't questioning the masons
Tracey Thu 14:44

River Thu 14:43 I say we lynch an illu, so they might have no choice but revealing tomorrow
River Thu 14:44

why the inquisition
Tracey Thu 14:44

You still dont understand do you?
Operative Thu 14:44

He meant illuminati
MrUniverse Thu 14:44

I did
Thu 14:44

Phone autocorrect
Operative Thu 14:44

And Meh has spelled out exactly how I feel too
MrUniverse Thu 14:44

My bad
Monty Thu 14:45

Why Inqu even exist in this game?
Operative Thu 14:45

We've either been dicked or they're vamps
River Thu 14:45

why? I feel fucked, you're doing great
Tracey Thu 14:45

River - you can lynch us down to one person, that last person still isnt going to tell you the vamp because they dont win unless the masons are down to 1.
Thu 14:45

until that condition is met, we dont want the game to end
River Thu 14:45

mutual assured destruction eh
Tracey Thu 14:45

it's very simple, i dont know why you arent getting it
River Thu 14:45

I get you
Tracey Thu 14:45

you talka bout pressuring us to do it - there is no alternative for us
River Thu 14:45

I just don't agree
Thu 14:45

yeah though luck
Operative Thu 14:45

Ribe still not considering masons being evil
Tracey Thu 14:45

no you dont, you think you can force us into revealing it
River Thu 14:45

my plan is still solid
MrUniverse Thu 14:46

I'd have believed the masons more if they had a similar win condition to the illuminati
Operative Thu 14:46

Suss intensifies
Monty Thu 14:46

Well. I don't really mind if Vamp win, if this is the way Village play a game.
Tracey Thu 14:46

you cant force us, there's no way to extract this from us without helping us bring the game to a state where we win
MrUniverse Thu 14:46

The fact it's complete faction elimination, that's too much
River Thu 14:46

then we all lose, great, and you called me out for the "I can lose us the game" you're doing the same right now.
Tracey Thu 14:46

Before this masons secret objective nonsense we were working on the village and factions working together against vamps
Operative Thu 14:47

Masons new objective bs is bs
Tracey Thu 14:47

I suggest we continue down that route
Thu 14:47

since it was productive
River Thu 14:47

maybe they're just bluffing?
Operative Thu 14:47

River still fine with it lol
Tracey Thu 14:47

maybe they are
Monty Thu 14:47

There is no new condition.
Operative Thu 14:47

Benefit of the doubt to them but us, we're bad for the village
Thu 14:47

Nice river
Tracey Thu 14:47

i'm still happy for them to stay alive but I need all but one dead by the time the last vamp is killed
River Thu 14:48

You understand you waste my time by not tellung us right?
Thu 14:48

or you wanna contest that?
Operative Thu 14:48

They are literally trying to do the same to us as we are to them. Yet you side with masons
Tracey Thu 14:48

im not wasting your time
Monty Thu 14:48

We keep talking the same thing
Tracey Thu 14:48

i do contest that
River Thu 14:48

you agree that you could win the game now?
Operative Thu 14:48

Can you imagine how river would react in our position?
River Thu 14:48

"for village"
Tracey Thu 14:48

and yes we are talking about things we've covered several times already, I can't get crayons out to explain it to river so i need to stop getting drawn in
River Thu 14:49

the good thing is, you have no benfit of lynching me
Thu 14:49

else you'd probably go for that
Operative Thu 14:49

Like imagine river. Your illu and TWO Masons come from the drinks. One with a potential to replace the ML. And now THEY EANT YOU DEAD
Thu 14:49

Like how is that not BULLSHIT?
River Thu 14:49

here, have some tissues
Niska Thu 14:50

Illu, the difference is we dont want to start the Illu killing now, you want to start today, we can wait till late game
Operative Thu 14:50

You've said many times you're going to kill us with the mw
River Thu 14:50

Operative, I'm working my ass off this game, and you tell me I should work against my belives to help you.
DrCaron Thu 14:50

'MW'
Operative Thu 14:50

You have no empathy
Tracey Thu 14:50

we want to start today because we have intel that can progress us towards winning so need to get our second objective complete before we can do that
River Thu 14:50

Ingame? No.
Monty Thu 14:51

FFS, we still have 20 peeps. We have long way to go. And there are 4 kill last night.
Operative Thu 14:51

And if you think it's balance to give the masons that then that's your privken
Thu 14:51

Probkemc
Tracey Thu 14:51

if we give up the vamps now, the town just takes it and wins
Thu 14:51

and we dont
Operative Thu 14:51

Problem
Niska Thu 14:51

Operative, I know how it feels, and that mw killing you was said one time.
Thu 14:51

As a sarcastic way to prove that he is still mw
Operative Thu 14:51

So I'm supposed to be happy that my team has just been fucked over?
Niska Thu 14:51

You saw Sheriff visiting Fanty
Operative Thu 14:52

I don't believe that would happen. So I think you're a vamp team
Thu 14:52

If you guys are masons I will flip my shit
Niska Thu 14:52

Then better prepare yourself
River Thu 14:52

don't be so childish
Niska Thu 14:52

Because we are masons.
Operative Thu 14:52

Shut up river. You have no capacity for seeing things from someone elseelse's perspective
River Thu 14:53

yo, you flame me all day for being "emotional" "personal" "petty", masons say they have to kill you and you go full enrage mode like you claim with me.
Operative Thu 14:53

It's so ridiculous
Niska Thu 14:53

Operative I understand your situation is awful, but trying to paint us as vamps wont help this game.
Operative Thu 14:53

That they would come back like that
Monty Thu 14:53

You said you know the next Vamp.
River Thu 14:53

You and if you'd see it from my side, you'd understand I don't like to be told what to do.
Tracey Thu 14:53

it just doesnt seem plausible Niska that the game could be skewed so much like that - so we think you are lying
Monty Thu 14:54

Now you said Mason is Vampire?
Operative Thu 14:54

I'm not painting. The only way I can understand you both claiming masons is that you are vamps. If you really became masons then the game was over yesterday
River Thu 14:54

You ridicule me for not being a fan of being bullied, and then you want Empthay from me?
Operative Thu 14:54

Literally not telling you what to do
Tracey Thu 14:54

you're being bullied? are you joking?
Operative Thu 14:54

Or ridiculing you
Tracey Thu 14:54

want me to paste the thing you were saying to me earlier today?
Niska Thu 14:54

I did not move n1, so I cannot be vamp unless you want to start being paranoid and say I prediceted this situation.
Operative Thu 14:54

You're the fam
Thu 14:55

Sheriff is the vamp
Niska Thu 14:55

Fanty is not the vamp because you saw the visit to Fanty
Wash Thu 14:55

The village right now: https://www.straight.com/files/v3/2012/10/Baby%20laugh-cry.jpg
Niska Thu 14:55

That leaves only Sheriff
Operative Thu 14:55

Only way this situation makes sense without it being horribly balanced against illu
River Thu 14:55

@Operative, how many days?
Operative Thu 14:55

What?
River Thu 14:56

How many days till you tell me.
Operative Thu 14:56

Tomorrow probably.
Thu 14:56

Depends what happens tonight
Moderator Thu 14:57

River votes to lynch SheriffBourne
Operative Thu 14:57

Would also like to point out that the vamp we found knows we found them
Mal Thu 14:57

<River> we basically could have won by NOW << I mean, we couldn't becuase of fam-rebirth and stuff, but still...
River Thu 14:57

I just want this to be over
Operative Thu 14:57

Because they know they recruited book
Thu 14:57

So beware lil vamp
River Thu 14:57

I hope there's never again a round like that.
Mal Thu 14:57

(Side note, can we all try to stay civil with each other when discussing things.)
Operative Thu 14:58

Yes
River Thu 14:58

This feels so wrong
Tracey Thu 14:59

In the way the game is setup village have been essentially given tools they can use - these sub factions that can vote with them and gather intel and confirm other villagers. To use these tools though you have to work with them and they require very specific things.
Niska Thu 14:59

Is there a trusted gd to dig Sheriff if you lynch him today? just asking, shooting him during the night is better for the village (but that would go aginst your objectives as that leaves him a recruit)
Thu 14:59

If you really need him killed that is
Wash Thu 14:59

I do believe River is the sole GD now, yes?
River Thu 14:59

-_-
Tracey Thu 15:00

I believe so
River Thu 15:00

guess who's gonna die
Thu 15:00

I'll be glad if I'm dead
Thu 15:00

never will be more glad to die tonight
Niska Thu 15:00

xD sorry River
Thu 15:00

I hope you stay
River Thu 15:00

this is the biggest shitshow since HTF
Tracey Thu 15:00

We dont want you dead, we just want you to wake up to the reality of how to win this game. You are trying to treat it like a wlf-xxx game
Thu 15:01

This is the way the game is, we need to work with what we've got
Mal Thu 15:01

Niska: in theory, you still get that recruit tonight if your role is accurate
River Thu 15:01

please just kill me dear vamps
Niska Thu 15:01

Mai but we loose 1 try in sheriff
River Thu 15:01

actually the fact that I'm the prime target tonight makes me happy
Thu 15:01

Probably wont give the check anyway
Thu 15:02

you know as "bargaining chip"
Thu 15:02

politics are fun
Thu 15:02

actually I'll probably do that^^
Thu 15:02

for funzies
Thu 15:03

But Jubl's gonna probably watch me -_-
Thu 15:03

and stitch whill behold me
Thu 15:03

-_-
Thu 15:04

So the check get's probably out anyway
Wash Thu 15:04

What do we want Higgins to do tonight?
Niska Thu 15:04

There is plenty of ways to prove us masons, but I understand that its the Illu goal to kill us.
Tracey Thu 15:04

Look at Niska?
Wash Thu 15:04

Same for Stitch depending on whatever he has.
Tracey Thu 15:04

Only to kill all but one of you Niska
River Thu 15:04

uhm
Tracey Thu 15:04

assuming you are mason
River Thu 15:04

so masons probably got the "all but one" as well?
Niska Thu 15:05

well we have to kill all Illu, how do you think we will do this with one left?
Tracey Thu 15:05

not according to them
River Thu 15:05

wouldn't conditions be the same?
Tracey Thu 15:05

the conditions should be as they are in HTP and thats what im working to
Thu 15:05

and the assumption im going with is that they are lying
Thu 15:06

otherwise it's massively unbalanced
Thu 15:06

so i have to assume thats not the case
River Thu 15:06

I understnad your point about the changed conditions
Thu 15:06

did I just say that..
Niska Thu 15:06

The objective is to remove the Illuminati, I interpret that as 0 left alive.
Tracey Thu 15:07

I dont believe that the mod would include that as a secret thing
Wash Thu 15:07

Or a thing.
River Thu 15:07

never had secret objectives
Thu 15:07

besides stuff like TAO/New factions
Tracey Thu 15:07

so all of this means that they are lying and not even masons
River Thu 15:07

or just bluffing :)
Tracey Thu 15:07

in which case let's kill them and then kill the vamps
River Thu 15:07

like you could
Wash Thu 15:08

Implying that there's some sort of distinction between them and the Vamps.
River Thu 15:09

you understand I dont trust you :) right= ;)
Thu 15:09

like on that part
DrCaron Thu 15:09

is the thinking that there is 1 VM or 2?
River Thu 15:09

min 2
Thu 15:09

could be 3
Thu 15:09

I'd put 3 in it
Thu 15:09

personally
DrCaron Thu 15:09

then why a MW?
River Thu 15:09

why not?
DrCaron Thu 15:09

that's more than enough killing power without a MW that cannot kill Vamps anyway
Thu 15:09

does not make snese
Thu 15:10

coven in here?
Thu 15:10

I realize i phrased that terribly
Tracey Thu 15:10

It's just crazy when you look at how it happened - Niska had like 10 votes on them when they sobered up, claimed plain villager, then claimed oh no actually they've been given this special new role of backup ML. Why would the mod choose someone with so much sus on them, current leader on votes to lynch and give them this lifeline - AND then they suddenly have this special win condition as well, only revealed when it becomes beneficial to them
Thu 15:10

all communicated through discord?
Thu 15:11

okay....
Thu 15:11

thats either fale or fucked up
Thu 15:11

I have to believe false
DrCaron Thu 15:11

MWs imply a lack of nightly killing. if even one of them is lit, then I suspect there is coven in here
River Thu 15:11

Tracey
Thu 15:11

jo let's talk politics
Thu 15:11

so who you wanna win with?
Thu 15:11

Inq? solO?
DrCaron Thu 15:11

idc
Thu 15:11

just not evils.
Tracey Thu 15:11

i just want to win, which means fulfilling my win condition and the village one
River Thu 15:12

my fear is
Thu 15:12

that we'll have the same problem with inq
Tracey Thu 15:12

I believe the best way to do that is to work with the village and the inq - and even the masons if they still exist and are willing
River Thu 15:12

and it goes oooon and oooon
Tracey Thu 15:12

we would, we need to help them complete their objective
Thu 15:12

but if we do
Thu 15:12

then the pool of possible evils is reduced
River Thu 15:12

inq doesn't collide right?
Tracey Thu 15:12

and we have all the roles available
River Thu 15:12

with oyu?
DrCaron Thu 15:12

so if masons are fake (which i think they are) ill and inq do not war with each other
Tracey Thu 15:12

no they dont collide with us
DrCaron Thu 15:12

so...
Thu 15:13

what's the issue again?
River Thu 15:13

I'm willing to go with ya, if this is the last war
DrCaron Thu 15:13

it only matters IF the masons are real and their story is terri-bad
Tracey Thu 15:13

all we want is for there to be max one mason, then we will do whatever we need to do to make the village win condition happen
Thu 15:14

we ar eopen to helping inq also but that is only if it helps the village win
River Thu 15:14

Well I have no pony in that race
Tracey Thu 15:14

otherwise it will all end up being backstabby and the evils can get in on that
River Thu 15:14

@Inq how many lynches you need folks?
Tracey Thu 15:14

I dont have a vested interest in inq winning, but if they help me achieve the village objective then i am for it
Thu 15:15

I have to go for a bit now
Thu 15:15

but i'm happy we are going in this direction
Thu 15:15

I'll be back later on
River Thu 15:15

This war is not want I want in an ext game.
Tracey Thu 15:15

i still think it's possible for all good factions to win
Thu 15:16

obviously only if this secret objective thing is false
Niska Thu 15:16

Tracey can we not postpone this war till some more evils got lynched? Its easy to prove us masons.
Tracey Thu 15:16

problem is the game could end and we dont win
Niska Thu 15:16

After that we can lynch each other if you want...
Tracey Thu 15:16

for illu and inq we need these other things taken care of first
Niska Thu 15:16

we also need to take care of it
Tracey Thu 15:16

allegedly
River Thu 15:16

you understand my slight annoyance with this dragging on for longer than "needed" from my point of view?
Tracey Thu 15:16

but thats not in the HTP so i dont believe it
DrCaron Thu 15:16

can i get a list of whom is in what subfaction?
Thu 15:17

this chat is horrendous to dig through
Tracey Thu 15:17

for you yes but its not dragging it out for me, im currently not winning if the last vamp dies
Higgins Thu 15:17

Why do i see 6 votes on Sheriff?
River Thu 15:17

don't ask
DrCaron Thu 15:17

(at tleast the ones who have been revealed)
River Thu 15:17

you don't wanna know
Tracey Thu 15:17

we think he's full of shit higgins
Thu 15:17

but i gotta go
Thu 15:17

so i'll be back later
Niska Thu 15:17

beholder can behold inquisitor but its not written in the h2p
River Thu 15:17

Operative here?
Tracey Thu 15:17

win conditions though...
Thu 15:17

anyway
Thu 15:17

*gone*
Niska Thu 15:17

And ours changed
Higgins Thu 15:18

Did we agree that illu is full of shit?
Thu 15:18

I need an update
Niska Thu 15:18

Higgins why you not check me last night q.q
Thu 15:18

would have spared us this shit
Higgins Thu 15:18

Can someone be nice and tell me what happened after i left?
Thu 15:19

Niska, completely trust you
Niska Thu 15:19

Illus came out
Thu 15:19

And now its a Illu vs mason war
DrCaron Thu 15:19

nah
Wash Thu 15:19

Basically we all doubt the Masons because of what is apparently some new win condition they have given to them through Discord, the Illuminati still withhold their check, Inquisition screaming, everyone else dabbing.
DrCaron Thu 15:19

mason's story is still ludicrous
Niska Thu 15:19

They all say Masons are vamps
Thu 15:20

Because our objective changed to remove Illus
River Thu 15:20

I don't really doubt them though -_-
DrCaron Thu 15:20

I would say you are some group of evils, I'm not convinced its vamps (although that would align with recruitment practices)
River Thu 15:21

the amount of fams points towards lots of vamps
DrCaron Thu 15:21

we have confrimed fams?
Higgins Thu 15:22

Wait, what? Their win condition changed?
Wash Thu 15:22

According to them, ALL Illuminati have to be dead for them to win.
MrUniverse Thu 15:22

Book and saffron were dug up as fam
Wash Thu 15:22

They were supposedly told through Discord.
Higgins Thu 15:23

What is going on with Badger?
River Thu 15:23

he killed some dud
Thu 15:23

inara I think
MrUniverse Thu 15:23

He got caught killing inara, and then claimed mw
Simon Thu 15:23

He killed a nasty nasty WC user
Higgins Thu 15:24

Hmm, and who saw him killer Inara?
MrUniverse Thu 15:24

The illuminati
Mal Thu 15:24

DrCaron: I gave a list of people in each faction earlier, look for "Masons:"
MrUniverse Thu 15:24

Nandi specifically
Higgins Thu 15:25

The mason just get weirder and weirder....
Wash Thu 15:25

That's why people sus them.
MrUniverse Thu 15:26

Yeah, I don't trust it
DrCaron Thu 15:26

MrU thanks for cutting through all the noise and actually answering my questions
River Thu 15:26

This is no attack against Illu or what ever
Thu 15:26

But....
Simon Thu 15:26

Which is why we are trying to lynch and dig Sheriff
MrUniverse Thu 15:26

Your welcome
Thu 15:26

*You're
Thu 15:26

Stupid phone
DrCaron Thu 15:26

lol
River Thu 15:26

I think we gomr some OK picture on what's going on, and for me it makes perfect sense to "reinforce" masons.
Higgins Thu 15:26

I still trust mason
Niska Thu 15:26

we could have just stayed quit about that objective change
Higgins Thu 15:27

Mason, recruit me ;-;
River Thu 15:27

for me reinforcing masons makes sense to keep the balance of the game
Operative Thu 15:27

But your objective change is different to the illu objective against masons
Niska Thu 15:27

Tracey and Objective even complained today that mason have this unfair advantage they can win with everyone
Thu 15:27

Guess what that changed now
Operative Thu 15:27

Yiurs says we all have to die
Thu 15:27

Ours just only 1 can remain
Thu 15:27

Why Would they be different?
Mal Thu 15:28

And to answer a question that was posed recently- inq don't currently require anyone to be killed or lynched, as I can purify Stitch / Higgins to meet their conditions
Niska Thu 15:28

why shouldnt they be different Operative?
Operative Thu 15:29

They are the same objective just in reverse. Why would you need to kill all of us? And we can leave 1
Thu 15:29

That means we can both win
Thu 15:29

With 1 mason and no illu alive
Thu 15:29

So that wouldn't work
Niska Thu 15:29

So there you have your reason
Thu 15:29

It is meant to be a war probably dont know
Operative Thu 15:29

These masons are full of bs
Thu 15:30

A war would mean there is no way for us to compromise
Mal Thu 15:30

Masons can meet their objective with their MW
Thu 15:30

if it is true
Niska Thu 15:30

Take your time lynch one mason after another and once you realise we are masons vm will have majority ;)
Moderator Thu 15:30

River votes to lynch Badger
Operative Thu 15:30

You have mw kill some fans
Mal Thu 15:31

Niska: we only need to lynch Sheriff to confirm you
Thu 15:31

as we can GD him
River Thu 15:31

You'd maybe get my vote if you were honest about why you want to get rid of them
Thu 15:31

but I don't like you guys mixing your objective with half truths
Thu 15:31

it feels like you're full of lies
Thu 15:31

1) say you want them dead because masons
Mal Thu 15:31

River: is this towards Operative now?
Niska Thu 15:31

And how can we achieve our objective if you want to lynch mason and vm/fams while our mw kills fams?
River Thu 15:31

2) say you want them dead because of vamp"
Thu 15:32

yes
Thu 15:32

I made peace with them, but god damn, this "they're full of shit" is irritating
Mal Thu 15:32

(Remember, Niska is mason, so him mentioning vamps is the masons saying it not the ilu?)
Operative Thu 15:32

They're either masons or lying either way I want them dead
Thu 15:32

Happy?
River Thu 15:32

=)
Mal Thu 15:33

The ilu have been consistently anti-mason, anti-vamp, pro-village from what I can see
Moderator Thu 15:33

Mal votes to lynch SheriffBourne
River Thu 15:33

I think you mixing your objectives kinda dilutes the water
Thu 15:33

So I would appreciate if we're clear on why we do things.
MrUniverse Thu 15:34

I think they've been pretty clear about things
River Thu 15:34

no, I don't think masons are full of shit
Niska Thu 15:34

who hasnt claimed yet?
Badger Thu 15:34

Just letting you know that I am reading back atm. Excited to see what happened to Sheriff.
River Thu 15:34

this is why I changed my vote back
Operative Thu 15:34

It's the masons who haven't been clear. They should have said if they had a new objective yesterday
River Thu 15:34

you didn't even claim yesterday.
MrUniverse Thu 15:34

Well, then your definition of clear is strange but ok
River Thu 15:35

I just can't vote someone I think is lit, because some subfaction wants it.
MrUniverse Thu 15:35

Apparently you can't
Mal Thu 15:35

I'm still not totally sold on masons anyway because of the potential numbers considered that ilu want them dead (it's a "make the game impossible for ilu" level of slap in the face)
Thu 15:36

so I'm happy to test SheriffBourne and MrU can hold his shot incase we're wrong if that makes people happier
River Thu 15:36

Actually I'm getting more frustrated again
Thu 15:36

-_-
Mal Thu 15:36

(Is it wrong that I'm enjoying today?)
River Thu 15:37

If you think masons are fake then no, if you think they're lit as a "neutral" as you claim, maybe?
Thu 15:37

neutral = no sub faciton?
MrUniverse Thu 15:37

I'm convinced enough to shoot them, regardless. At worst, I'm helping the illuminati
River Thu 15:37

you know what I mean
Thu 15:38

mrU why?
MrUniverse Thu 15:38

I don't believe all the extra nonsense in their claim
DrCaron Thu 15:38

...b/c their story makes zero sense
River Thu 15:38

why?
MrUniverse Thu 15:38

And if it is true, it's so bullshit for the illuminati that I want to help them
Operative Thu 15:38

I wish I could recruit MrU and Mal
River Thu 15:38

not me? :D
Operative Thu 15:39

I mean maybe you third
River Thu 15:39

3rd
Thu 15:39

*offended*
Thu 15:39

:P
Operative Thu 15:39

Lol
River Thu 15:39

I NEVER PLAY THIRD FIDDLE
MrUniverse Thu 15:40

As for whybi don't believe them, I don't believe all this extra stuff that was added, the ML apprentice, and the extra win condition that demands all illuminati die
River Thu 15:40

but the last part backfired hard
Thu 15:40

so uhm
MrUniverse Thu 15:42

Doesn't make it more true
Thu 15:42

The way they add to their claim
Thu 15:42

Every time one of them gets closed to being lynched, something new gets added
River Thu 15:42

since I've expirienced changes to my role in the past, I maybe see it different
DrCaron Thu 15:43

care to elaborate?
Thu 15:43

for context
MrUniverse Thu 15:43

If they had been upfront with everything, maybe, but extra stuff just keeps being added
River Thu 15:44

Like being changed from vanilla to seer or something, it's a uncommon thing but sometimes role changes happen
DrCaron Thu 15:44

did it happen through Discord?
Moderator Thu 15:44

Higgins votes to lynch Badger
DrCaron Thu 15:45

b/c that is where I refuse to budge.
Thu 15:45

Mod has the ability to msg a personal individually in game
Higgins Thu 15:45

Let's just lynch Badger and give them time, we will talk about this more tmr
DrCaron Thu 15:45

there is no need for a third party msg service
River Thu 15:45

yes
Higgins Thu 15:46

I was messaged through discord
Thu 15:46

You should sus me too
DrCaron Thu 15:46

so when I sober up I am just sscrewed?
Thu 15:46

yes i do.
Thu 15:47

I was going to wait until tomorrow but I think i will forego my original plan
Thu 15:47

i did sober up today
Thu 15:47

I am a MW
Thu 15:47

and I did not get BS through discord
Thu 15:47

so try again
River Thu 15:47

bring me alcohol
MrUniverse Thu 15:47

Haha
Higgins Thu 15:48

Boom
DrCaron Thu 15:48

all masons are full of shit; MWs are sus af
Higgins Thu 15:48

Hmm, mws are sus
Thu 15:48

*Suses Dr*
DrCaron Thu 15:49

go for it; liar
Higgins Thu 15:49

Say something new
DrCaron Thu 15:49

the mod msh when i sobered up was at the bot of chat
Thu 15:49

impossible to miss
Thu 15:49

how's that for new?
Badger Thu 15:50

All this subfaction war is too much for me.
DrCaron Thu 15:50

no email, no 3rd party service
Thu 15:50

so if you are still whole heartedly backing them up, you are in league with them
Thu 15:50

see you tonight
MrUniverse Thu 15:50

Colour me surprised. Stuff involving 3rd party programs is probable nonsense
DrCaron Thu 15:50

^^^^
Higgins Thu 15:50

Sure, kill me
Badger Thu 15:51

So I skipped the last part. Anyway. Has any stalker actually seen me visiting without my target dying? I have literally only moved twice and in both instances I've killed my targets.
Higgins Thu 15:51

I will haopy to get killed
Thu 15:51

End my suffet
Thu 15:51

*suffer
DrCaron Thu 15:51

Niska is higher on my list tbh
MrUniverse Thu 15:51

No, badger, you were only seen killing
Badger Thu 15:52

How are people so sure I'm vamp when I've only "been caught" killing? That is exactly what maple does.
DrCaron Thu 15:52

so can we lycnh sheriff, i can eat Niska
Badger Thu 15:52

Will someone tell my why Sheriff has so many votes? I gave up in the midst of internal figthing between the village.
Higgins Thu 15:53

Just consider that if the mason and i was lit drunk then the 4th drunk maybe too much :)
DrCaron Thu 15:53

or i cna just eat NIska anyway
Badger Thu 15:53

DrCaron. Did you sober up into maple?
Higgins Thu 15:53

I will happy if Fanty eat Dr tonight
DrCaron Thu 15:53

yes
Thu 15:53

today
Badger Thu 15:53

Cool.
MrUniverse Thu 15:53

Sheriff has added to his mason claim, that they need to kill all illuminati to win
Badger Thu 15:53

Didn't someone say that they saw make a non lethal visit?
MrUniverse Thu 15:54

This was considered by many to be the last straw in a lot of nonsense that surrounds them
Thu 15:54

I think Sheriff was seen visiting fanty, hence his votes
Badger Thu 15:55

That I can se would be sus. Don't come for me when you don't have proof that I did anything but kill.
DrCaron Thu 15:55

Did you forecast your intentions?
Thu 15:55

and was it for the benefit of the village?
Higgins Thu 15:55

Do you know what is nonsense? Drunk sobered up to mw. I would like to think if Dr was lit drunk, she could have sobered up to something evil
Operative Thu 15:56

And the two masons are bs
DrCaron Thu 15:56

^
Thu 15:56

I have every intention of killing Niska
Thu 15:56

tonight
Badger Thu 15:56

I did not share my intentions because I'm not part of any subfaction. Had I outed myself as Maple I would've put a target on my back. I also thaught it was better if evils thought there was only one Maple
Operative Thu 15:56

Anyway, I think the current evils are the mason clan and badger
Thu 15:57

And mystery vamp
River Thu 15:57

grml ^^
DrCaron Thu 15:57

I had to out myself to show how completely full of shit the mason's are
River Thu 15:57

Don't make me salty again operative,i just started to like you :P
DrCaron Thu 15:57

I would've prefered to just eat them quietly
Operative Thu 15:57

I'd like Higgins to check some evils to find a vamp
Higgins Thu 15:57

Operative, just shut up. I haven't liked illu since the moment you guys baited us with info about vamp
Badger Thu 15:57

The mason clan does seem like a vamp basement. But I assure you that I am no vamp.
Operative Thu 15:58

Wow Higgins
Badger Thu 15:58

I moven N2 and N4. Both nights my target died.
River Thu 15:58

I think...
Higgins Thu 15:58

The illu is in my black list now
River Thu 15:58

I think even more...
Moderator Thu 15:58

Badger votes to lynch SheriffBourne
River Thu 15:58

there is something wrong
Badger Thu 15:58

^For obvious reasons
River Thu 15:59

I think nobody thought about it yet..
Thu 15:59

but
Operative Thu 15:59

I also motion that Dr sobering to mw could indicate that a mw was lost last night. To a vampire recruit PERHAPS
River Thu 15:59

Do we think 2 or 3 vamps?
Thu 15:59

THIS IS IMPORTANT
Higgins Thu 15:59

2 is minimum
DrCaron Thu 15:59

I am in the 2vm boat
River Thu 15:59

yo so
Thu 15:59

here's the deal
DrCaron Thu 15:59

but I have no data to back that up
Badger Thu 16:00

I think no more than two VM's
Thu 16:00

And no less than two VM's
River Thu 16:00

IF ILLU ARE NOT LYING MASONS ARE INNOCENT
Badger Thu 16:00

So. I think there are two VM's
River Thu 16:00

WHY YOU ASK
DrCaron Thu 16:00

I think your shift key is stuck
River Thu 16:00

IF MASONS ARE THE VAMPS, ILLU WOULDN'T TELL US
Thu 16:00

elese they'd lynch their "secret vamp"
Thu 16:00

lol
Operative Thu 16:01

We can't be lying. Higgins checked me as village and why would the masons have a special objective to kill us if we don't exist
River Thu 16:01

you can lie about the second vamp
Thu 16:01

So you say Fanty is vamp
Thu 16:01

you say you got another vamp
Operative Thu 16:01

Sheriff
River Thu 16:01

and now a thrid?
Operative Thu 16:01

But he isn't the vamp we have found
River Thu 16:01

So you say sheriff is your secret vamp?
Thu 16:02

seee
Operative Thu 16:02

No
Tracey Thu 16:02

No
Operative Thu 16:02

Sheriff is either a mason or a vamp
River Thu 16:02

You're so fuking dishonest it's hard to trust you guys
Tracey Thu 16:02

Sherrif is not our secret vamp
Operative Thu 16:02

Probably the latter based on all the bs
Higgins Thu 16:02

Just want to clarify that i could be insane seer and Operative could be evil
Operative Thu 16:02

We have literally never changed our story
Thu 16:02

How is that dishonest
Tracey Thu 16:02

We have never claimed sherrif was the second vamp
River Thu 16:02

This is about we lynching someone who illu want in the sus of them being vamp
Tracey Thu 16:02

Why would we do that
River Thu 16:02

yes, but this implies a minimum of 3
Operative Thu 16:03

Why would you sober into an insane seer
River Thu 16:03

So if you don't think 3 vamps, don't vote masons
Operative Thu 16:03

In a 30 playing game
Tracey Thu 16:03

Basically they have such a bullshit story they are almost certainly lying
River Thu 16:03

yeah but you try to sell them to us as vamps
Thu 16:04

which is really really shady
Tracey Thu 16:04

Well what other evil are they
Operative Thu 16:04

Nope. Everyone is saying they are either masons which is bs or vamps so happy to lynch
Thu 16:04

Have you read the chat?
Tracey Thu 16:04

If they're good then they're mason and we still want them dead
Higgins Thu 16:04

Sure, mason story is weird so i why not i can be weird like that
Tracey Thu 16:04

Different kind of weird
Thu 16:05

Like bullshit weird
Operative Thu 16:05

Don't really trust Higgins. Why didn't you check the masons?
Tracey Thu 16:05

Like they claim they were told this special info through discord of all places
Higgins Thu 16:06

Simple, because you are sus in my eyes
Operative Thu 16:06

Badger is a vamp btw just wanna make sure we have that on record
Tracey Thu 16:06

But didn't tell us the whole info they were told
Thu 16:06

Okay sure thing Masons, sounds legit
Operative Thu 16:06

Lol
Badger Thu 16:06

Op, I'm getting so annoyed by you. Literally your only "proof" I'm vamp is that you've seen me kill. As does the Maple. Had you seen me visiting without killing it would be another storye
Tracey Thu 16:07

Your reasons for killing do not make sense
Operative Thu 16:07

Why would you ever kill a protector as a mw on a night you font have to kill anyone
Tracey Thu 16:07

Like zero sense
Operative Thu 16:07

Like you said oh she's a vamp YOU CANT EAT VAMPS. And if she didn't die. She's a protector
Badger Thu 16:07

Whether they make sense to you or not, it doesn't change the fact that I can only make lethal visits
Operative Thu 16:07

Like c'mon that story is bogus
Badger Thu 16:08

Okay. Let me try and explain it again.
Higgins Thu 16:08

Badger, if somehow people lynch Sheriff and you still alive tonight, kill illu for me
DrCaron Thu 16:08

@Badger:MW/Vamp is the same as Court/DW. they behave very similarly and to err on the side of caution village wants dead out of self preservation
Operative Thu 16:08

You don't kill basically confirmed power roles
Tracey Thu 16:08

He already killed illu last night
Operative Thu 16:08

Get over it Higgins
Thu 16:09

Higgins is the worst seer I've ever seen
Thu 16:09

*sees someone as village after sobering up
Thu 16:09

Guess I'm the insane seer Lolololi
River Thu 16:09

Since you wouldnt give us the hidden vamp. This is a huge reason for me to think masons are real
Higgins Thu 16:09

You are the worst illu i have ever seen
Tracey Thu 16:09

How does that follow River?
Operative Thu 16:09

Good comeback man
DrCaron Thu 16:09

@River: wut
MrUniverse Thu 16:10

Why? They got badger
Higgins Thu 16:10

I have seen better illu in game with multi sub-faction
Operative Thu 16:10

Great and?
River Thu 16:10

They say they got two vamps
Tracey Thu 16:10

We do
River Thu 16:10

One of them we know
Tracey Thu 16:10

Badger and one other
River Thu 16:10

The other is not sheriff. Since they would lose
Operative Thu 16:10

You think you sobered into an insane seer. Dear God I'm pissing myself at the lengths you will go to not believe the illu
Tracey Thu 16:10

Correct
River Thu 16:10

So why we lynch sheriff?
Tracey Thu 16:11

Because they are lying
Thu 16:11

So are bad
Operative Thu 16:11

I mean you know why we want him dead
Thu 16:11

This has been said so many times
DrCaron Thu 16:11

I m not following the 'its not sheriff' part
Operative Thu 16:11

Not sure what's confusing to you
River Thu 16:11

Yeah but this indicates for me they are lit
Tracey Thu 16:11

How are they lit based on that?
MrUniverse Thu 16:11

Wow, that's certainly some sort of thinking
River Thu 16:12

Because because it's not your vamp
Higgins Thu 16:12

Looks like i want mason death?
River Thu 16:12

It's quite easy
MrUniverse Thu 16:12

So, maybe badger is fam?
Badger Thu 16:12

I noticed Inara confirmed Shepherd's claim as stalker. Next thing you know Shepherd is dug in GY and found to be familiar. It makes sense for a vamp to claim protector, because if they don't die "they probably self protted". To me it looked like Shepherd and Inara were confirming eachother, therefore Inara was vamp in my eyes. I tried to eat her because i thought she wouldn't die as vamps are immune to night kills. I expected her to survive and then I would return to village to let you know, that I was unable to kill her. With all the stalkers I was actually pretty certain that I would be seen visiting her, which would then back up my theory. But I admit that I was wrong and eating Inara was a mistake.
MrUniverse Thu 16:12

Could still be 2 vamp
Operative Thu 16:12

Also insane seer only sees opposite of wolves right. Not fam and vamp. So am I a wolf now Higgins?
Higgins Thu 16:13

Are you claiming wolf?
Tracey Thu 16:13

From our POV they are either 1) truthful about this mod shit, and so are mason and we want them dead or 2) they are lying and some kind of evil, in which case we are happy for them to be dead because no more masons
Operative Thu 16:13

Higgins is making me WEE
Higgins Thu 16:14

WAA
Tracey Thu 16:14

River does that clarify it for you?
Operative Thu 16:14

Like HE checked me
Thu 16:14

This is too good
River Thu 16:14

No, this is not about them
Thu 16:14

it's about you which makes me think its not them
Tracey Thu 16:15

Then I'm not following still, can you explain?
River Thu 16:15

I want to find a vamp
Thu 16:15

you don't want me to find the vamp
Operative Thu 16:15

Badger
Thu 16:15

There you go
River Thu 16:15

the second one
DrCaron Thu 16:15

Sheriff
Tracey Thu 16:15

This specific secret vamp
Operative Thu 16:15

Kill away
River Thu 16:15

No
Tracey Thu 16:15

Yes
River Thu 16:15

@Caron it's NOT sheriff
DrCaron Thu 16:15

maybe?
Operative Thu 16:15

You can only lynch one a day
DrCaron Thu 16:15

I asked for you to excplain why it si not
River Thu 16:15

because then they'd give us both and lose their bargain power
DrCaron Thu 16:16

and i keep getting ignored
Thu 16:16

which is very agravating
Tracey Thu 16:16

Yes sherrif is not our second secret vamp
River Thu 16:16

they wont give us both
Thu 16:16

see
MrUniverse Thu 16:16

Badger could be a fam
Operative Thu 16:16

We will. Tomorrow
Fanty Thu 16:16

Woah catch me up
River Thu 16:16

they sell it as vamp
Operative Thu 16:16

No patience
MrUniverse Thu 16:16

Leaving sheriff, and their other check as the vamps
Tracey Thu 16:16

Stop - sell what as vamp?
DrCaron Thu 16:16

what bargaining power?
River Thu 16:16

yeah but we kinda know sheriff is not one of the two vamps
Fanty Thu 16:16

Did no one see that sheriff is a mason? He recruited me last night
Tracey Thu 16:16

I'm literally telling you that
DrCaron Thu 16:16

lol
Operative Thu 16:17

Lol fanty
River Thu 16:17

I'll do it from the start
DrCaron Thu 16:17

Fanty the other secret vamp
Higgins Thu 16:17

Fanty, Dr is wanting to kill your team. Make sure you kill her tonight
Badger Thu 16:17

I can't with this subfaction BS anymore. If you decide to lynch me, fine. But know that you will not have gotten rid of a vamp. My top sus is Zoe. Like HOW has she managed to not get noticed for lack of participation. Next on my list is the Masons.
DrCaron Thu 16:17

@Fanty: I sobered up today as a MW
Thu 16:17

no discord BS
Fanty Thu 16:17

Sorry, I haven't read back today
DrCaron Thu 16:17

so I do not believe the masons whatsoever
Operative Thu 16:17

Fanty, are you a fam now?
Fanty Thu 16:18

Okay, well I was literally recruited into masons today
DrCaron Thu 16:18

and that alos means there are 3 living MW claims
Operative Thu 16:18

What's your objective
DrCaron Thu 16:18

so welcome to the hot seat
Operative Thu 16:18

Fanty
River Thu 16:18

Ok so Illu say they found 2 vamps, they tell us one in exhcange for some mason heads, they wont tell us the second. So them voting masons means they are NOT voting their second vamp, so this means a) 3 vamps and the second vamp they know including team is somewhere else, OR Masons are innocent. because we know it's not the second vamp they keep bakc.
Tracey Thu 16:18

Obviously we know you were visited by sheriff, so you are recruited into whatever team that is
Operative Thu 16:18

How do you win the game?
Tracey Thu 16:19

Correct we are not voting our second vamp that would be dumb
MrUniverse Thu 16:19

They saw badger kill inara
Tracey Thu 16:19

And we know as much as you do about if they are real mason or not
MrUniverse Thu 16:19

Badger could be militia familiar, not the vamp
Tracey Thu 16:19

Bit illu don't care either way
Thu 16:19

We want them dead regardless
Operative Thu 16:19

Also river, we have you one. WHERE IS MY MASON HEAD
Higgins Thu 16:20

No one promised you anything
Operative Thu 16:20

Given you a vamp
Fanty Thu 16:20

I am mw in the masons. Has there been anything to change this. Are you really Also content with killing villagers instead of evil?
Operative Thu 16:20

So I'll add Higgins to the list of unhelpful villagers
Tracey Thu 16:20

Fanty sherrif added in some extra nonsense about needing to also kill all illuminati
Operative Thu 16:21

We were working well together. Trying to make sure everyone wins then the masons need to add more bs to their fire
Fanty Thu 16:21

Illuminati, why not just kill the evils until we confirm they are dead, then we kill the masons til there is one left, then everyone wins
Tracey Thu 16:21

Which is a secret objective given to them by the mod over discord
Operative Thu 16:21

Because they don't want to village to work together
River Thu 16:21

I think you're selling us shit.
Fanty Thu 16:21

That way we can reliably and safely kill the masons without vamp intervention
Tracey Thu 16:21

Because if wet kill all the evil, the game ends
Thu 16:21

And we lose
Badger Thu 16:21

Operative will feel so stupid tomorrow when the whole village finds out it's bullshit because I'm not actually a vamp. The Illu haven't given you a vamp.
Operative Thu 16:22

Lol badger
River Thu 16:22

I think the illu got one
Thu 16:22

not 2.
DrCaron Thu 16:22

^
Tracey Thu 16:22

We have given the information we have about you
Thu 16:22

We believe you are a vamp
DrCaron Thu 16:22

not revealing a vamp is stupid.
River Thu 16:22

you dudes try to sell us 2
Fanty Thu 16:22

But why sheriff? A guy we know is village?
Badger Thu 16:22

Mark my words. If a GD is alive to dig me, he/she will let you know that I was not vamp.
River Thu 16:22

I buy one
Tracey Thu 16:22

Then you made yourself look like one
Fanty Thu 16:22

If you want to kill masons, why not kill a useless mason, killing the leader isnworse
DrCaron Thu 16:23

@Tracey: you know another you cannot win? when the 'vamp' you haven't outed just kills you
Operative Thu 16:23

Niska should become a leader according to their claim
DrCaron Thu 16:23

so...
Thu 16:23

Niska will be dead
Tracey Thu 16:23

Yes but I have to do the mason one first
Operative Thu 16:23

We all know the second vamp
River Thu 16:23

"the mason one"
Tracey Thu 16:23

Please tell me I don't have to explain this again
Higgins Thu 16:23

Fanty, do me a favor, eat Dr
Thu 16:23

Fanty, they want to lynch Sheriff and Dr will eat Niska
DrCaron Thu 16:23

I still get one meal in
Thu 16:24

@Higgins: that is correct
River Thu 16:24

eat illu so they tell us -_-
Tracey Thu 16:24

The sooner the masons, if there are any, are down to one the sooner we will just reveal all
Fanty Thu 16:24

My god, please stop this cavalcade of shitposting haha.
Operative Thu 16:24

If you eat us we won't tell you
River Thu 16:24

then we win it wouthout you
Tracey Thu 16:24

River we won't tell you at any point
Fanty Thu 16:24

Tracey, you are asking for the village to kill like 6 villagers for you to reveal one vamp
River Thu 16:24

this is how you build trust eh? :)
Fanty Thu 16:25

Does that not feel silly?
Operative Thu 16:25

Nope just 1
Tracey Thu 16:25

We are offering to help us all win
Thu 16:25

Not six, just two
Operative Thu 16:25

We were actually happy to kill badger but then the masons came out with their bs objective
Fanty Thu 16:25

I haven't seen this bs objective, where is it?
Operative Thu 16:25

Still happy to kill sheriff to badger. Both are good targets for me
Thu 16:26

They said they have a new special objective sent to them
Tracey Thu 16:26

I prefer sheriff on the off chance that are true mason
Operative Thu 16:26

To kill all illuminati
Zoe Thu 16:26

N'evening. I just started reading back and it took me 20 minutes just to get to 11am. Am I correct in having understood that Badger was outed as vamp by the Illus?
Operative Thu 16:26

Which isn't in the h2p
Tracey Thu 16:26

This was revealed to them on discord by the mod
River Thu 16:26

Look, if you guys want to win as village, stop being so dishonest
Tracey Thu 16:26

We are not being dishonest
Zoe Thu 16:26

I am not sure I have all the time in the world to read every little nuanced discussion.
River Thu 16:26

you are
Tracey Thu 16:26

We have been very up front
River Thu 16:26

you're selling me the masons as vamps for some reasons
Operative Thu 16:26

We aren't being dishonest
Thu 16:26

We literally arent
Zoe Thu 16:26

Why are there votes on Sheriff?
Higgins Thu 16:26

Zoe, claim pls
Operative Thu 16:26

We are happy to kill them. Mason or vamp
River Thu 16:26

because he's mason
Thu 16:27

lol
Operative Thu 16:27

How is that dishonest
Tracey Thu 16:27

He's either mason or evil
DrCaron Thu 16:27

yeah Mod messaged me on Discord and said I can only win if I do not wash my socks until the game ends
Tracey Thu 16:27

We've literally said it over and over
Operative Thu 16:27

LOL
MrUniverse Thu 16:27

I recommend Badger changes his role and says a mod did it
Operative Thu 16:27

Lol
Higgins Thu 16:27

Zoe, don't disappear without a claim
Operative Thu 16:28

Badger sobered up into a mason
MrUniverse Thu 16:28

People will definetly believe him then
Tracey Thu 16:28

Mod messaged me on twitter DM and said I need to get people as angry as possible to win
Thu 16:28

He then sent me a letter in the post with a new role
DrCaron Thu 16:28

#DiscordWinConditions
River Thu 16:28

bla bla
Thu 16:28

you have no clue Tracey
Thu 16:28

seriously
Thu 16:28

this shit happens.
Zoe Thu 16:28

I am not disappearing, I am reading.
Thu 16:28

GIVE ME A SEC
DrCaron Thu 16:28

good luck
River Thu 16:29

So you can meme everything else
Operative Thu 16:29

Love that river and Higgins are getting testy when badger is the one getting lynched atm
Tracey Thu 16:29

You'll need more than a minute Zoe
River Thu 16:29

I have my vote on badger smartie
Zoe Thu 16:29

Yes I know.
Operative Thu 16:29

Like EHY ARE WE LYNCHING MASONS - We aren't
Zoe Thu 16:29

I have a bunch of questions, but maybe they have already been answered so I am trying to read back.
DrCaron Thu 16:30

extracting intel from this chat is difficult
Higgins Thu 16:30

Claim and we will answer them for you
Tracey Thu 16:30

You would get different answers depending on who you ask
DrCaron Thu 16:30

Higgins posted a claim list
Thu 16:30

ctrl+F 'claim list'
MrUniverse Thu 16:30

I'm actually still waiting for the next stage of the mason claim
DrCaron Thu 16:30

it is incomplete, but a good starting point
MrUniverse Thu 16:30

I wonder what will be added next?
Zoe Thu 16:30

@Higgins I am not being forced into anything by anyone.
River Thu 16:31

you can think I'm vamp, salty or what ever, but some msg per discord HAPPENS
Fanty Thu 16:31

I can't find a message from sherriff saying he got a message on discord saying masons need to kill illus
MrUniverse Thu 16:31

Maybe they need to fight the inquisition as well
Fanty Thu 16:31

Its not in the h2p either?
Operative Thu 16:31

Same MrU
Higgins Thu 16:31

The claim list hasn't been updated
Operative Thu 16:31

The next chapter
DrCaron Thu 16:31

Next Season on The Masons...
Zoe Thu 16:31

I am sorry, is there now doubt that the Illu are selling us vamps?
River Thu 16:31

I think they got a real one, and a plushy
Thu 16:31

they wanna sell us both as real
MrUniverse Thu 16:31

The illuminati revealed that badger killed inara
Fanty Thu 16:31

Can anyone copy+paste this message from sheriff about him being told via discord
MrUniverse Thu 16:32

They say they saw who recruited book n1
DrCaron Thu 16:32

him and niska
Thu 16:32

@fanty
MrUniverse Thu 16:32

But won't reveal that until some masons are dead
Thu 16:32

Since then, the masons added to their claim that they need all illuminati dead to win
Fanty Thu 16:32

Hold up, I didn't say this
MrUniverse Thu 16:32

This is not a normal mason win condition
Fanty Thu 16:32

I haven't seen a discord message stating this
MrUniverse Thu 16:33

Ok, sheriff and niska
Thu 16:33

Who are claiming mason
Zoe Thu 16:33

Thank you @MrU
MrUniverse Thu 16:33

And saying they recruited fanty
Moderator Thu 16:33

Zoe votes to lynch Badger
MrUniverse Thu 16:33

You're welcome
Fanty Thu 16:33

Sheriff I can guarantee is mason, I can't speak for niska since I haven't been in a night chat yet
MrUniverse Thu 16:33

(Phone got it right this time)
Fanty Thu 16:33

But I haven't seen any discord messages
Thu 16:34

Why would the mod tell ONLY sheriff? I don't get this
Thu 16:34

Is this normal for stuff like this? Discord messages really seem to be weird places for conveying in-game info for any reason
MrUniverse Thu 16:34

Exactly
River Thu 16:34

I don't lie about such stuff -_-
MrUniverse Thu 16:35

Which is why people don't trust them
Fanty Thu 16:35

Can someone more experienced confirm that people do or don't get discord messages for things like htis
River Thu 16:35

I say otherwise since x hours.
Thu 16:35

but what ever.
Fanty Thu 16:35

But they recruited me, so I have to try and work out why sheriff would lie about this
Thu 16:35

Well, sheriff recruited me, again, I have no clue about niska
DrCaron Thu 16:35

you got recrutited last night?
Fanty Thu 16:35

For the last time, yes. Sheriff recruited me last night
Tracey Thu 16:35

Yes so he won't know until tonight
Zoe Thu 16:35

Has Higgins been confirmed lit seer?
DrCaron Thu 16:35

then you would never have seen night chat
Thu 16:36

Fanty is lying
Fanty Thu 16:36

So I can confirm sheriff is mason, but can't speak for niska
Operative Thu 16:36

Higgins thinks he is insane
Fanty Thu 16:36

Dr how? What part is lying
Zoe Thu 16:36

right
Fanty Thu 16:36

Try and hide your fangs whilst you explain it I guess
DrCaron Thu 16:36

you do not get to participate in night chat the night you are recruited
Tracey Thu 16:36

We are pretty sure he is lit, but he doesn't like the illu
Zoe Thu 16:36

he was drunk though, and then got seer but maybe insane seer
Fanty Thu 16:36

Which is PRECISELY what I've said 3 times now DrCaron
Thu 16:36

Look up
DrCaron Thu 16:36

Fanty Thu 16:35 For the last time, yes. Sheriff recruited me last night
Fanty Thu 16:37

Fanty Thu 16:33 Sheriff I can guarantee is mason, I can't speak for niska since I haven't been in a night chat yet
Zoe Thu 16:37

A lot of people don't seeeem to like the llu Tracey lol
Tracey Thu 16:37

To be fair to Fanty he hasn't claimed he was in last night's chat
DrCaron Thu 16:37

the night you are recrutied you find out the next morning
Thu 16:37

he said he can confirm sheriff
Fanty Thu 16:37

Yes Dr, this is what I have said multiple times
Tracey Thu 16:37

I know Zoe but that's the way the cookie crumbles
DrCaron Thu 16:37

b/c of he showed up in night chat
Thu 16:37

a caht he could not have seen yet
Thu 16:37

if his recruitement claim is true
Fanty Thu 16:37

YES, it says 'SheriffBourne has recruited Fanty into the Masons.'
DrCaron Thu 16:37

my bad
Fanty Thu 16:37

That's the mod message I get
Operative Thu 16:38

Because apparently a 2 day long claim that develops every time they are voted for is so believable
DrCaron Thu 16:38

that explains it
Fanty Thu 16:38

Please, PLEASE put your fangs away Doc
DrCaron Thu 16:38

you mentioned not seeing someone in night chat
Thu 16:38

which implies you were in one
Thu 16:38

hence my immediate sus
Fanty Thu 16:38

Let me copy-paste it YET AGAIN for you
Thu 16:38

Fanty Thu 16:33 Sheriff I can guarantee is mason, I can't speak for niska since I haven't been in a night chat yet
DrCaron Thu 16:38

i am already with you
Tracey Thu 16:38

No he said he can't vouch for niska
DrCaron Thu 16:38

and i admitted my mistake
Thu 16:39

down boy
Tracey Thu 16:39

As he has not seen s night chat
Fanty Thu 16:39

Now, can we talk about why we are still trying to have the village kill each other
Thu 16:39

If someone can copy-paste this message from Sheriff about the discord relaying of the objective, I would be very thankful, I can't find it anywhere
Operative Thu 16:39

Badger has the most votes
DrCaron Thu 16:39

let me dig out the discord BS for you
River Thu 16:40

It's... not.... B ... S...
MrUniverse Thu 16:40

It really is
Thu 16:40

The fact people believe it is laughable
DrCaron Thu 16:40

14:03:13 Niska Oh, I also saw the discord message now, seems like I am some kind of special villager you might not want to lynch me :P
Operative Thu 16:40

Lol
Fanty Thu 16:40

All I know is I can guarantee Sheriff is Mason. I have to believe that either what he is saying about discord is true, or that he has some weird reason for making all this up. I really don't know what to believe for now
Operative Thu 16:40

I don't see why people believe it either
Fanty Thu 16:41

Lol that does seem ridiculous
Thu 16:41

Mod, can you bring in your little hammer avatar and give us a ruling on whether mods message people in discord about secret objectives?
JubalEarly Thu 16:41

JubalEarly is JubalBack
Fanty Thu 16:41

That really seems like somethign that should either be in the h2p or that should be more clearly explained in the h2p section
Operative Thu 16:41

Read up?
Tracey Thu 16:41

Scroll back to 14:12
JubalEarly Thu 16:41

@Fanty I don't think so
River Thu 16:41

Jubal watch me tonight, so I can dig that shit up.
Operative Thu 16:41

Jubal
JubalEarly Thu 16:42

@Op and Tracey you talking to me?
Fanty Thu 16:42

in the pre-game e-mail or the h2p section*
Tracey Thu 16:42

For mason objective bullshit
Operative Thu 16:42

I would watch Nandi
JubalEarly Thu 16:42

ummmmmmm a lot of things being said
Thu 16:42

I think I'm just gonna read
River Thu 16:42

WHY NANDI?
Fanty Thu 16:42

I think messages at peak activity points are actually sent faster than you can read old ones
River Thu 16:42

oh your "lookout"
Operative Thu 16:42

watching nandi means we confirm any deaths on the illu team
River Thu 16:42

lol
Thu 16:43

convinient if I die, eh?
Tracey Thu 16:43

Jubal I wasn't talking to you
Operative Thu 16:43

because if she dies jubal knows, if she doesn't nandi will know
River Thu 16:43

No shit, Nandi will know if she doesn't die?
Thu 16:43

amazing
Operative Thu 16:43

but if nandi dies we won't know who killed her
Thu 16:43

hence jubal
Thu 16:43

that harlots 4 people in the game
Thu 16:43

for sure
River Thu 16:44

yeah and if jubal doesn't watch me, we don't know if masons are real
Thu 16:44

that's a trade of 3:1 vs 1:1
DrCaron Thu 16:44

I am struggling to find a place where sheriff makes simliar claim about discord messages, but he still vouches for Niska
Operative Thu 16:44

so 4 people or 1 person
Thu 16:44

hmmmm
River Thu 16:44

me confirming/not confirming masons has huger implications than your shitty lookout
DrCaron Thu 16:44

so in my book they are still linked
Operative Thu 16:45

not really
River Thu 16:45

Wrong
DrCaron Thu 16:45

how is that?
Operative Thu 16:45

But we can just behold you
Thu 16:45

means that the gd is still know
Thu 16:45

don't need a harlot for thR
River Thu 16:45

how needs a harlot for your bunch
Mal Thu 16:45

To clarify the discord thing: It's not beyond the realms of possibility for Mod to talk to people via discord to explain nuances about their role to them that may not be clear from the game UI for whatever reason.
River Thu 16:45

less of you is beneficial
Operative Thu 16:45

gv behold you, 4 people harlotted
Thu 16:45

how is that bad
River Thu 16:46

less of you would be more progress
Operative Thu 16:46

so you're happy for illu to die and not masons
River Thu 16:46

would encourage your bunch to actually hurry up
Operative Thu 16:46

which are basically the same now since masons want illu dead
River Thu 16:46

yeah but you got the info
Operative Thu 16:46

so masons can't end the game with us alive either now
River Thu 16:46

some death on your sight might speed things up
Operative Thu 16:46

So you're fighting against ALL factions now
River Thu 16:47

mhh why?
Mal Thu 16:47

What is unusual is people specifically saying "I got the message on discord" rather than just saying that their role says X.
Operative Thu 16:47

Because we all have two objectives
River Thu 16:47

I don't
Operative Thu 16:47

and you got mad at us for persuing ours earlier so you should be annoyed at all subfactions
River Thu 16:47

@Mal thanks someone talking sense
Operative Thu 16:48

I think harlot on lookout is the best play with gv on the gd. That is all
Thu 16:48

That means we make sure we get the dig AND we harlot 4 people
River Thu 16:48

I disagreee
Thu 16:48

your info is basically "safe"
Thu 16:48

you said yourself everyone know it
Operative Thu 16:49

It isn't if we all die
JubalEarly Thu 16:49

(I'm switching off between reading backlog and reading current chat)
Operative Thu 16:49

i dont see how harlot on you is better
JubalEarly Thu 16:49

its a doozy
Tracey Thu 16:49

yes the sooner you guys can help us get to 1 mason, the sooner we can get our intel out before we all die
Thu 16:49

if we all die it dies with us
Operative Thu 16:49

we have a neholder
Tracey Thu 16:49

so the opposite of what river said is true
Operative Thu 16:49

your info is safe
Tracey Thu 16:49

to speed this up, help us not kill us
Operative Thu 16:50

the fact that you don't want 4 people harlotted is weird
Tracey Thu 16:50

killing us speeds up our intel going to the GY
Operative Thu 16:50

spite against one faction or evil? hmmm
Thu 16:52

Anyway I'm gonna take a break
Thu 16:52

cya
River Thu 16:53

@Jubal watch me, the Illu can't take a loss, besides nobody gonna dare anyway, so it's wasted.
Thu 16:53

*can take
JubalEarly Thu 16:54

Op Thu 12:59 Also note for future. In this multi faction setup. Masons need a downside against illu or inq
Thu 16:54

idk if this was ever responded to
Thu 16:54

but I think ML starting by himself balances the factions overall
River Thu 16:54

they get their downside later on
Thu 16:54

continue reading :)
JubalEarly Thu 16:54

ok
Thu 16:54

ya im still way back
Tracey Thu 16:59

when the other factions are in the masons should have a second win condition
Thu 16:59

such as the "kill illuminati"
Thu 16:59

but this needs to be known before the game starts that this is their objective
Thu 16:59

otherwise we wouldnt just come out and volunteer all of our members
Fanty Thu 17:00

Tracey, the blackmailing of info where you trade one vamp for two mason deaths is still pretty unbalanced, can you not agree there?
Tracey Thu 17:00

no you are characterising it in a way i dont agree with
River Thu 17:00

they do it for "their win" everyone has to submit to that.
Tracey Thu 17:00

before we can kill vamps, we need the mason condition to be met
Fanty Thu 17:01

Why not get the vamp count down to one then start killing masons? Way less unrealiable variables then
Tracey Thu 17:01

otherwise we dont want the second vamp to be known
Thu 17:01

because we have no control over that
Thu 17:01

and can lose
Fanty Thu 17:01

Tracey, we horrifically weaken village before killing the vampires? You surely agree that doesn't make sense
Operative Thu 17:01

why is everyone crying, the vamo has the most votes
Tracey Thu 17:01

im not weakening the village
Thu 17:01

i am part of the village also
Mal Thu 17:01

Killing 1 mason was a show of faith towards the illuminati. The theory was that we could kill all-but-one of them to satisfy the illuminati, purify the WC users to satisfy the Inq and then everyone wins.
Tracey Thu 17:01

as are the confirmed members of my faction
Thu 17:02

correct mal
Fanty Thu 17:02

Killing two masons is very definitely weakening the village haha
Tracey Thu 17:02

and thats how we would prefer to proceed
Mal Thu 17:02

Then the masons came out and declared suddenly that the needed to kill off everyone illuminati
Operative Thu 17:02

A mason isn't even getting lycnhed
Tracey Thu 17:02

which i dont believe
Fanty Thu 17:02

Yes, I'm happy with that, but getting vamps down to one is a priority first for me
Tracey Thu 17:02

I think it is too far fetched that this is a secret win condition given to them
Operative Thu 17:02

the vamp has the most botes
Thu 17:02

Fanty
Thu 17:02

seriously
Tracey Thu 17:02

yes, people have competing objectives
Fanty Thu 17:02

I know I know op
Tracey Thu 17:02

i understand that
Operative Thu 17:03

So how are we killing two masons?
Mal Thu 17:03

We have a militia willing to shoot a mason for us to give that show of faith. The Masons have their MW to do what they need if they really must (Though I think their claim is a "I don't want to die" claim not a real objetive)
Fanty Thu 17:03

You want to kill two masons correct? That's what I'm referring to
Mal Thu 17:03

They need to kill all-but-1
Fanty Thu 17:03

I have to say, I wish sheriff could explain his discord thing to us.
Tracey Thu 17:03

The bottom line is we cant give the vamp up until we have met our condition of 1 mason left, otherwise we lose
Operative Thu 17:03

Yes eventually because it's our win condition
Thu 17:03

it isn't a choice
Fanty Thu 17:03

I can absolutely trust he is mason, but I can't trust that that is true
Tracey Thu 17:04

people are thinking of it like we still kind of win if the village wins
Mal Thu 17:04

Tracey: to be fair, you said you'd give them up tomorrow if we killed a mason today
Tracey Thu 17:04

we dont
Operative Thu 17:04

we gave a vamp, that vamp is getting lynched, i dont' see the problem
River Thu 17:04

lol
Thu 17:04

Tracey Thu 17:04 we dont
Tracey Thu 17:04

well the plan was give the first tomorrow
Thu 17:04

but sadly our third illu decided to just give it for free
River Thu 17:04

masons "changing their story"
Tracey Thu 17:04

so we are trusting i t you
Thu 17:04

River what are you talking about
River Thu 17:04

god you're awful at building trust
Operative Thu 17:05

i'm happy for us to work together until the bloody masons came and ruined it
River Thu 17:05

@mal we wont get shit
Operative Thu 17:05

"actually we have a new win condition lol"
Tracey Thu 17:05

why did you quote me saying "we dont"
River Thu 17:05

that's exactly why I'm not a fan of the deal
Operative Thu 17:05

YOU HAVE A VAMP
Thu 17:05

wtf is your deal
River Thu 17:05

Because Mal and others assumed you give the second tomorrow
Tracey Thu 17:05

river you realise we need the vamps to die to win as well?
Thu 17:06

this is clear to you, yes?
River Thu 17:06

I don't want to be associated with you in any way.
Operative Thu 17:06

Is it tomorrow yet?
Tracey Thu 17:06

so obviously we are going to give them as soon as it's safe
Operative Thu 17:06

Can you see into the future to see if we will or won't do that?
Thu 17:06

NO
River Thu 17:06

I make my own team
Operative Thu 17:06

So shut up until tomorrow then you can complain about it
Mal Thu 17:06

I have no reason so far to believe that they won't co-operate with the rest of the village
Tracey Thu 17:06

we are village
Thu 17:06

we NEED the village to win
River Thu 17:07

they just changed it from "tomorrow" to "you already have one"
Operative Thu 17:07

River just likes conflict and loves masons with dodgey claim
Tracey Thu 17:07

What I was negotiating earlier is what you were quouting
Thu 17:07

But that was changed when our third illu came and gave it for free
Thu 17:07

which was not the plan
Fanty Thu 17:07

Operative and Tracey, you guys are far too focussed on talking about who burned the bridges to build any
Operative Thu 17:07

The point is your complaining that we aren't giving information when we have
Fanty Thu 17:07

Just let it all go
Operative Thu 17:07

we gave you a vamp
Tracey Thu 17:07

we really havent been, weve been very open to working with everyone
Operative Thu 17:08

so how are we still pariahs?
Tracey Thu 17:08

because we want the village to win
Thu 17:08

but we cant do that yet or else we lose
River Thu 17:08

No
Operative Thu 17:08

You believe th masons when they have nothing by bs sounding claims but god forbid we actually try and keep something back to ensure cooperation
River Thu 17:08

Operative told me an hour ago, tomorrow
Tracey Thu 17:08

it's that simple. The faster you help us achieve our objective the faster are fully on your side
Fanty Thu 17:08

Just stop. Start again. You have a vamp check you claim you are hiding. If a militia kills a mason tonight, will you give the other vamp over?
River Thu 17:08

OP told me probably tomorrow
Operative Thu 17:08

I said Tomorrow probaby
Tracey Thu 17:08

Well we'll need to discuss it tonight, obviously we are not able to discuss during the day
Operative Thu 17:09

depending on tne night
River Thu 17:09

you LIE
Thu 17:09

all the fking time
Tracey Thu 17:09

My opinion may be different to operative
Operative Thu 17:09

fgs
Thu 17:09

River is insatiable
River Thu 17:09

Tracey doesn't sound at all like "tomorrow"
Fanty Thu 17:09

Hahaha. So we cannot reach a consensus today you say?
Operative Thu 17:09

like what does she even want
Wash Thu 17:09

fkn arrogance
Fanty Thu 17:09

Just ignore river Jesus
Tracey Thu 17:09

we are two different people after all - my opinion is that we cant give the secret vamp up until the masons are down to 1 and no more ML
MrUniverse Thu 17:09

Can we lynch Sheriff to annoy River?
Operative Thu 17:09

it isn't tomorrow yet but apparently we've already not given the imfo?
Thu 17:09

I would love that
Thu 17:09

Lol
Tracey Thu 17:09

operative may think differently but we will discuss tonight
Fanty Thu 17:09

You realise that means the masons are very likely to be killed off entirely and make the game harder right?
Operative Thu 17:10

masons aren't getting lynched
Tracey Thu 17:10

no because we have a strong illuminati and an inq who we can work with also
River Thu 17:10

@Mal we don't get anything out of this
Operative Thu 17:10

so at most 1 dies, you still get a recruit
Thu 17:10

that's hardly dying off
Tracey Thu 17:10

it's a good chunk of confirmed village and votes you get with the sub factions
Operative Thu 17:10

Ignoring River now, no idea what she wants not sure she does
Thu 17:11

We give a vamp, she's mad
Tracey Thu 17:11

we'll discuss tonight but it may be that we can give the vamp as they will go to familiar
Thu 17:11

presuming they have them
Operative Thu 17:11

She's already mad about us "not giving" info tomorrow, like why don't you wait and see
Thu 17:11

jesus christ
Tracey Thu 17:12

so we will have time to reach our objective, but the problem we have is that people wont want to focus on that
Thu 17:12

and we have no way to achieve it without the village lynching them
Thu 17:12

so we need the village to do this first really in my opinion
Thu 17:12

otherwise we will just lose
Thu 17:12

but we'll discuss tonight
Thu 17:13

River: if we gave you all the vamps we know now are you saying you would suddenly not want to go and lynch them and only them?
Thu 17:13

Of course you would
Thu 17:13

as would the rest of the village, minus inq
Thu 17:14

which is why we cant do that now
River Thu 17:15

Vm has fams
Thu 17:16

We lose precious time with this shit
Tracey Thu 17:16

then lets kill masons fast and get on with it
Thu 17:16

Vote sherrif, he may not even be mason
Thu 17:16

if we kill him you can dig and confirm
Thu 17:16

then we know
River Thu 17:16

I wont be alive to see that anyway
Tracey Thu 17:17

you are almost certainly not dying tonight
River Thu 17:17

Lol
Tracey Thu 17:18

anyway i have got to go again for a bit - you should lynch sherrif becuase he's either 1) dodgy as fuck with this insnae discord message secret role bullshit or 2) a mason and we can start killing vamps sooner
Thu 17:18

I'm asking people to change to sherrif for this reason
Thu 17:18

bye for now
River Thu 17:21

1) Discord messages from mod exist
Thu 17:22

2) killing masons to find some secret vamp... Yeah ... uuuhhhh
Wash Thu 17:29

1. no
Thu 17:29

2. eh
Thu 17:29

fkn arrogant river
Mal Thu 17:41

I'm still happy about lynching SheriffBourne as an option right now as it tells us something from a GD dig tomorrow and settles the "are the masons a thing? what about discord?" thing once and for all
Thu 17:42

Masons get Niska as a new leader to replace him anyway, so no huge loss there
Thu 17:42

I'm also happy if MrU or DrC wanted to kill/eat Sheriff instead tonight and we can dig tomorrow night, but that puts us through another day of this
Thu 17:43

Ultimately we all want the village to win, just in subtly different ways, and I think it's still possible to get an everyone win
Moderator Thu 17:51

Nandi votes to lynch SheriffBourne
JubalEarly Thu 17:57

my goodness
Thu 17:57

I kid you not
Thu 17:57

I have been reading this whole time
Thu 17:57

I don't even know where to start
Thu 17:57

Did Nandi give her lookout reports at least?
Thu 17:57

or just from last night?
MrUniverse Thu 17:59

just last might i believe
JubalEarly Thu 18:00

gross
Thu 18:01

Like early on when Op and Tracey were complaining about how mod was so unfair to illu if he sobered up masons
Thu 18:01

is like so far from true
Thu 18:01

like what was the status of things at the time
Thu 18:01

0 living masons
Thu 18:01

4 illu...
Thu 18:02

and it's not like they don't know who the masons are. like about time they finally came out
Thu 18:02

was just waiting for inara to claim it
MrUniverse Thu 18:03

eh, i believe them more than the masons
Thu 18:03

especially with everything they are trying to claim
JubalEarly Thu 18:03

I'm not saying I don't believe them
Thu 18:03

but their "woe is us" attitude is tilting
MrUniverse Thu 18:04

i can understand it
Thu 18:04

to go from, everything is fine, to oh, suddenly we have at least 2 different mason leaders to deal with
Thu 18:04

with a potential 3rd if Kaylee is revived
JubalEarly Thu 18:06

I mean it's not like they really had to play for their win condition before the drunks sobered up
Thu 18:06

ml died n1 and they were like ok we're basically better masons with no other win condition
River Thu 18:06

No no help or other info from the lookout
JubalEarly Thu 18:06

and then didn't tell us shit
Thu 18:06

they were riding so easy and decided to keep quiet
Thu 18:06

when they apparently had a vamp
Thu 18:06

and no living masons
Thu 18:06

like that was a thing
River Thu 18:07

It's funy how supposedly every mason was dead and they didnt tell us about the n3 recruit
Thu 18:07

N2
JubalEarly Thu 18:07

right?
MrUniverse Thu 18:08

well, i dont think they came online until after the "drunks" sobered up
River Thu 18:08

Of course they do
JubalEarly Thu 18:08

They had all of D3
MrUniverse Thu 18:08

No, we lynched Book D3 because he fucked up his claim
JubalEarly Thu 18:08

and drunks sobered up late af D4
River Thu 18:08

Like 99 % they were there
MrUniverse Thu 18:08

d4, was when the confirmation happened
JubalEarly Thu 18:08

that doesn't mean they can't say "hey btw we found a vamp" D3
Thu 18:09

ML is dead and we are illu so lets get this rolling
MrUniverse Thu 18:09

unless book was a stalker
JubalEarly Thu 18:09

but no
MrUniverse Thu 18:09

then they out a power role instead
Moderator Thu 18:09

Jayne votes to lynch SheriffBourne
JubalEarly Thu 18:09

like now shit is tough for them
Thu 18:09

but they didn't help us when they were on top of the world
Thu 18:09

recruited a prot, found a vamp, ml dead
Thu 18:09

lets wait though
Jayne Thu 18:10

I do not believe the mason claims now - I might be able to believe mod changing the win condition for one player and telling them in discord, but I do not believe they would not tell each player who had that win condition what they needed to do to win.
River Thu 18:10

WHY ARE YOU CHANING TO SHERIFFF FFS
Thu 18:10

this is utter bs
Moderator Thu 18:10

JubalEarly votes to lynch Badger
River Thu 18:10

mod telling you stuff in private is totally normal
Thu 18:10

I've had that happen MULTIPLE times
JubalEarly Thu 18:10

^
Jayne Thu 18:10

But follow me here
MrUniverse Thu 18:10

Jayne has a point
Jayne Thu 18:11

Fanty
MrUniverse Thu 18:11

Why wasnt Fanty told?
Jayne Thu 18:11

Fanty makes it all bullshit
River Thu 18:11

he wasnt in night chat
Thu 18:11

why
Jayne Thu 18:11

By the MOD
River Thu 18:11

he's new
Thu 18:11

NO
MrUniverse Thu 18:11

So why wasnt he messaged in discord/
Jayne Thu 18:11

not by the masons
MrUniverse Thu 18:11

like all the other claims
River Thu 18:11

MOD WOULD GIVE AWAY THE GAME
Thu 18:11

by telling him before night chat
MrUniverse Thu 18:11

But he gets told he's recruited
Thu 18:11

so why wouldnt he be told his new win condition
Jayne Thu 18:11

Mod needs to tell player his win conditions - Fanty cannot be a mason and also say he does not know anything about mod messages
River Thu 18:11

yeah and his recruiter or what ever could be recruited
Thu 18:12

Mason would tell him at night
Jayne Thu 18:12

The masons are bullshit
MrUniverse Thu 18:12

since apparently, the mod needs discord to tell people stuff, instead of this game
River Thu 18:12

god...
Jayne Thu 18:12

and I think River is way too sure of this so he may be same version of bullshit
River Thu 18:12

for fucks sake
JubalEarly Thu 18:12

I mean yesterday I was so against the mason claims
River Thu 18:12

I KNOW THIUS FUCKING SITE
JubalEarly Thu 18:12

but this illu stuff makes me believe it more
River Thu 18:12

I KNOW WHAT HAPPENS HERE AND HOW IT HAPPENS
Jayne Thu 18:12

well I can learn more someday - for now - masons and River are full of shit in my world
JubalEarly Thu 18:12

Can they not give us anything at all?
MrUniverse Thu 18:13

they gave us badger
River Thu 18:13

I'm fill of shit??
JubalEarly Thu 18:13

like I'd appreciate Nandi's other checks
MrUniverse Thu 18:13

the guy who killed Inara
JubalEarly Thu 18:13

ok so vote him
MrUniverse Thu 18:14

Im willing to believe Badger is stupid maplewolf more than this build a new mason role that they're trying to peddle
Jayne Thu 18:14

Even if you know it is possible, the problem I just pointed out with Fanty is real and you did not even hesitate - so I am super sus of you as well as the Masons
River Thu 18:14

hesitate on what?
JubalEarly Thu 18:14

so then they gave us nothing
MrUniverse Thu 18:14

They think he's a vamp
River Thu 18:14

this goes back to my
Jayne Thu 18:14

To wonder why the mod would not tell Fanty their own win condition in a game
River Thu 18:14

"Illu wont tell us the vamp"
JubalEarly Thu 18:14

they won't tell us anything except that one check
River Thu 18:15

so it's clear they're not the vamp, it even makes sense in the illu book
JubalEarly Thu 18:15

they also didn't tell us anything when there were 0 masons
MrUniverse Thu 18:15

And chances are, he is, but this story claim from the masons stinks worse, so im going for that first
Jayne Thu 18:15

I refuse to believe the mod gave the masons a new win condition and did not tell the new mason about it.
River Thu 18:15

NEW mason
Thu 18:15

see the new there?
JubalEarly Thu 18:15

judging on how strong illu was, I think it makes a lot of sense
River Thu 18:15

THis game is balanced around the 3 sub factions
Thu 18:15

obviously this doesnt work if masons die n1
Mal Thu 18:16

In fairness, when these factions were introduced, the new members get told nothing until the night
MrUniverse Thu 18:16

so why did they sober up so late?
Thu 18:16

and during a conversation about lynching them?
River Thu 18:16

what Mal said
Thu 18:16

love you mal
Thu 18:16

<3
Jayne Thu 18:16

If they make a new win condition for a team they would need to tell the people in the game, they can't let him play a whole day not knowing what it takes to win. That is either incompetence or bullshit, and I choose bullshit.
Mal Thu 18:16

if it's a new win condition, it's possible fanty wouldn't know until they were recruited.
Thu 18:16

and spoke at night
JubalEarly Thu 18:16

Thats sooooo not true
Thu 18:16

@Jayne
River Thu 18:16

of course mod wouldn't tell him before he spoke to his team
Mal Thu 18:17

(eg look at ext-100 or ext-200 when ilu/inq/masons were introduced - almost always the first night thing from a recruit will be "sooo, what do we do?" or so
River Thu 18:17

maybe he would have misssed the recruit
Mal Thu 18:17

)
River Thu 18:17

or Sheriff get's recruited by vamp etc.
Mal Thu 18:17

(This isn't to say that I believe it, I'm just saying it has history)
River Thu 18:17

Mal
Jayne Thu 18:17

Okay I will just quit this game if that turns out to be true because I don't like games where you don't know what the rules are, but in the mean time I choose to believe you are all making this shit up.
River Thu 18:18

I thank you for confirming history at least, because I understand going for sheriff but we do it for the wrong reasons
JubalEarly Thu 18:18

jesus
Mal Thu 18:18

Jayne: heres a hint - don't join ext-300 ;)
River Thu 18:18

Mod has to balance the game, WHY are there drunks ;)
JubalEarly Thu 18:18

^
Jayne Thu 18:18

I am all for drunks that is a perfect way for mod to balance game.
JubalEarly Thu 18:18

(my arrow was for Mal but it applies to what river said too)
Jayne Thu 18:18

Changing win conditions mid game and not telling anyone is bullshit.
River Thu 18:19

well
Thu 18:19

you forget something
Thu 18:19

maybe he told kaylee
JubalEarly Thu 18:19

Mod can't just come into the chat and be like "ya here's the deal"
River Thu 18:19

so kaylee dies, mason are dead, so he has to tell it again
JubalEarly Thu 18:19

cause that unfairly confirms the masons
Mal Thu 18:19

The message when you are recruited is literally "you have been recruited to <faction> by <person>" or so - it tells you nothing about the faction - your player info page doesn't change either (as you're not a new role etc). You learn about your faction from talking to your other members at night
Jayne Thu 18:19

He can apparently talk on discord, so since that is part of this problem he can make an announcement there if he likes. I am not buying this story.
JubalEarly Thu 18:20

ummm same thing applies if he says it on discord
Fanty Thu 18:20

Hi so trying to catch up here
JubalEarly Thu 18:20

it unfairly confirms the masons
Mal Thu 18:20

Mod LIKES not everything being totally public. He doesn't like things being totally solvable, or confirming things
Fanty Thu 18:20

If I were to get a message in discord, where would I get it? I've got no direct messages on discord that I can find and I am ont he discrd server
River Thu 18:20

every public announcement would confirm th factions
Mal Thu 18:20

Confirming that masons have a new win condition would confirm that SheriffBourne is a mason and that he's telling the truth, because he would know it first
JubalEarly Thu 18:20

if mod told us its like "ok well I guess masons have to be lit"
River Thu 18:20

what Mal said
Thu 18:21

Jubal and Mal, you bring back my hope in humanity
Thu 18:21

<3
JubalEarly Thu 18:21

:)
Fanty Thu 18:21

I can guarantee that Sheriff is mason, as that is what my recruit message said this morning. I have not been in a night chat so cannot *confirm* that niska was a mason too
Mal Thu 18:21

Fanty: it would likely be a DM from kirshstien of you were getting anything specific that wasn't sent from `moderator` in game
Fanty Thu 18:21

But then again, it would be a weird life for sheriff to make up and agree with niska if they weren't both masons...
Mal Thu 18:21

(Sorry Mark, I butchered the fuck out of your name there)
JubalEarly Thu 18:21

Fanty I get where you are coming from but if you fully believe Sheriff then niska is pretty lit
Thu 18:21

since Sheriff confirms niska
River Thu 18:21

hahahaha
JubalEarly Thu 18:21

ya know?
Jayne Thu 18:21

If the mod was going to change a win condition it would have been in the first email we got.
JubalEarly Thu 18:21

untrueeee
River Thu 18:21

no, it spoils the whole setup
JubalEarly Thu 18:22

he could add a new role and not say anything about it
Thu 18:22

changing a win condition is like meh
River Thu 18:22

if you write "Masons got a new win condition" guess what's gonna be in the setup eh?
Mal Thu 18:22

Jayne: Considering when inq/ilu were introduced we didn't know they existed at all and their win condtions were known only to that faction, you're wrong
Fanty Thu 18:22

I've had another look, I've got no messages I can see
JubalEarly Thu 18:22

did we even know there was gonna be a new faction when undead showed up?
Mal Thu 18:22

(infact even as ext-200 came to a close, no one but the inq knew their "no magic users alive" clause)
Jayne Thu 18:22

Well whatever, I have two choices, this is a game I don't want to play in at all and I quit, or I distrust the bullshit I would not accept as a player.
River Thu 18:22

I trust mod on setups and drunk decisions.
Fanty Thu 18:22

That's what I'm saying Jubal, I couldn't explain sheriff lying about niska, so I suppose I have to trust them
Mal Thu 18:22

JubalEarly: we did not, they were a total surprise to us all
River Thu 18:23

that's the whole exictement about blind games
Mal Thu 18:23

boo-001 - Revenant, Gravewarden - new
Thu 18:23

etc
Thu 18:23

There is precedent
River Thu 18:23

you have to roll with it
Thu 18:23

and mod is good at it
JubalEarly Thu 18:23

so ya, Jayne if you don't like surprises then stick to wlf-xxx cause the other games are gonna have curveballs
Mal Thu 18:23

(This is why the ext games are "no newbies")
JubalEarly Thu 18:23

if its not your thing thats fine
Jayne Thu 18:23

There should be something somewhere in the documentation that says this is part of the game.
River Thu 18:24

jayne, I get your feelings :) But we jkust tell you you shouldn't base this lynch on the mod msg
Thu 18:24

try to decide by other factors as well :)
JubalEarly Thu 18:24

well there was a warning to new players
Mal Thu 18:24

But, despite precedent and everything else, I still don't fully believe the masons - as they would know this as well and use it to their advantage in a game like this that is blind
Fanty Thu 18:24

I understand and think curveballs are sensible, but hiding game mechanics or revealing them to certain players (especially in this case where it seems to have been revealed to one mason and not the others) seems weird and too meta to be sensible
Jayne Thu 18:24

I don't believe the masons any more.
JubalEarly Thu 18:24

I think most experienced players expect this craziness by now
River Thu 18:25

fun fact
Fanty Thu 18:25

I understand that ext games are no newbies, butalso, everyone has to have their first ext game at some point...
JubalEarly Thu 18:25

@Fanty I think it makes sense to only reveal to one of them and not just any person they recruit
River Thu 18:25

first basement game was a surprise too :)
Thu 18:25

VM was introduced blindly
Mal Thu 18:25

Fanty: if it is the case, it was liekly only told to Sherrif, and he would have told niska last night and you tonight as you get to talk to each other. The recruit message is literally just that, it doesn't tell you anything about the faction.
River Thu 18:25

quite a fun game
Fanty Thu 18:25

Either way, I'm of the opinion that not killing a mason tonight makes more sense than lynching one. We have a probably vampire to lynch which should be of much higher priority
Mal Thu 18:25

First VM game was pretty wonderful
River Thu 18:25

oh yessss
JubalEarly Thu 18:25

clearly the point of this game is that the entire village is setup in a way where they want/need to kill each other
River Thu 18:25

with the right teammates^^
JubalEarly Thu 18:25

so its like
Thu 18:26

how do we navigate that
Mal Thu 18:26

there was 2 of them, didn't know each other existed. much hilarity as they both thought they were the only beand new one
Jayne Thu 18:26

I really like this game so far - like I said I am relatively new - but if changing the rules is what needs to happen to make it interesting I am not that into this.
JubalEarly Thu 18:26

it evolves
Mal Thu 18:26

(also, equally with VMs recruiting they don't get to learn what type of fam they recruited until night)
Fanty Thu 18:26

We navigate the village subfactions (I think), by getting our vamp basements down to one before trying to sort out the village
JubalEarly Thu 18:26

but like I said, if its not your cup of tea thats np
Mal Thu 18:26

Jayne: Mod is fair and honest, you can trust that anything he's done has been to make the game fun
JubalEarly Thu 18:26

wlf-xxx games won't have this
River Thu 18:26

Jayne, don't let your enjoyment be ruined by this. We know the feeling but so far in retrospect it has turned out to be a good thing :) Mod is really good with making interesting rounds
Fanty Thu 18:27

Vamps are a complete unknown to all the villagers and can do unexpected things as well as recruit villagers into familiars. Eradicating a whole vamp basement should be priority imo
River Thu 18:27

I wrote him some salty messages today about this one
Thu 18:27

but I have to say it's a new spin
JubalEarly Thu 18:27

pretty much anything someone claims can be possible (within *some* reason) so we just gotta base it on how we feel
Jayne Thu 18:27

If that is the case then people should be smited for talking about outside messages and such. I do not like this.
JubalEarly Thu 18:27

not what the existing rules are
River Thu 18:27

which is rly cool if you can calm down :D
Thu 18:27

@Jayne yeah mentioning mod messages is a tricky thing
Thu 18:28

I try to avoid it. Always
Thu 18:28

*hugs jayne*
Fanty Thu 18:28

Also, no one was able to copy-paste a game chat message showing sheriff saying he had been messaged on discord about a secret objective
River Thu 18:28

is it ok if we move on a bit?
Fanty Thu 18:28

I've asked multiple times and no one could show me the message this entire discussion was based on. I've looked back at all sheriff's messages and can't find it either
Mal Thu 18:29

Mentioning Mod messages is generally frowned up, which is why sherrif said specifically "<SheriffBourne> I'm unwilling to go meta, that's why I say it's in my role description."
Fanty Thu 18:29

Can ANYONE find it please
JubalEarly Thu 18:29

Fanty I think he was trying to avoid it and just said its part of his role
Thu 18:29

like if he recruited you then why not just trust him?
Thu 18:29

I don't get it
Jayne Thu 18:29

I am totally out of this game now - I am into the outside issues of the entire game mechanics - I dislike this and think it is a poor way to run anything - I will just retreat from this game
Fanty Thu 18:29

I know, I have to trust him, but we also don't have much clarification about the implications of that message
JubalEarly Thu 18:29

jaaaayyyyynnneee
Fanty Thu 18:29

I'm trying to work out if people have inferred something from that message incorrectly or not
River Thu 18:29

@Jayne take a break for now, come back tomorrow and see it in new eyes.
Thu 18:30

Trust me.
Thu 18:30

I had lots of those moments before
Thu 18:30

I had one of those this afternoon :P
Thu 18:30

where I was "fuck I'm out of this shit"
JubalEarly Thu 18:30

I was pulling my hair out trying to read everything today
Thu 18:30

like omg
Thu 18:30

I must have spent an hour and a half reading through it
River Thu 18:30

ok, I still wanna move on a bit
Thu 18:30

I think I got some good companions here
Thu 18:31

So
Thu 18:31

1) you guys think Illu is lit=
Thu 18:31

since I got opinions from some already this is mostly to Jubal and Mal
Fanty Thu 18:31

I have to say, lynching someone for whom there is a lot of evidence that they are a vampire (i.e. badger), rather than the mason just because illu want a mason dead RIGHT NOW seems silly to me
River Thu 18:31

but obviously everyone can tune in
JubalEarly Thu 18:32

are you asking if we think illu is lit?
River Thu 18:32

yes
Thu 18:32

sorry for the =
Thu 18:32

should be a ?
Thu 18:32

I expect a yes^^
JubalEarly Thu 18:32

ooooh gotcha. I'm inclined to believe them, especially the way Inara was acting
River Thu 18:32

but I got some follow ups
MrUniverse Thu 18:32

They also gave us Badger, who we are believing to be some sort of vampire
River Thu 18:33

I was very sure of inanra
JubalEarly Thu 18:33

very sure she was illu or lit?
River Thu 18:33

that she was lit
Thu 18:33

since I dug kaylee
JubalEarly Thu 18:33

(I felt pretty sure of both)
River Thu 18:33

kinda sealed the deal for me
JubalEarly Thu 18:33

makes sense
River Thu 18:33

good
Thu 18:33

do we think they got 2 vamps?
JubalEarly Thu 18:34

that's a tough one
River Thu 18:34

next is are there 3
JubalEarly Thu 18:34

I think its true that they saw someone visit Book
MrUniverse Thu 18:34

at least 2, no more than 3
River Thu 18:34

because then I come up with the "if it's 2 vamps, it's not masons" thing
Thu 18:34

if we think 3 possible
Thu 18:34

but 2 makes masons being vamps almost impossible
JubalEarly Thu 18:34

we haven't had much evidence of any other factions
Thu 18:35

I'm feeling 3 VMs
River Thu 18:35

I forgot numbers
Moderator Thu 18:35

Jayne votes to lynch Zoe
MrUniverse Thu 18:35

how does 2 makes masons being vamps impossible?
Thu 18:35

masons could be one
River Thu 18:35

no they wont tell us
JubalEarly Thu 18:35

cause illu would know both VMs
MrUniverse Thu 18:35

Saffron, Badger and Book could be familiars to the vm that the Illuminati know
JubalEarly Thu 18:35

with neither being masons
River Thu 18:35

since if they tell us both their game ends too fast
Thu 18:36

So illu voting masons means 1) 3 vm's or more or 2) they just wanna sell us the mason lynch as vamp
MrUniverse Thu 18:36

all they know is badger killed inara. Badger could be militia familiar
Jayne Thu 18:36

I just don't want to be part of this - so I am removing myself. I wasted hours reading this nonsense today. Good luck.
River Thu 18:36

or 1 & 2
Thu 18:36

I feel like Jubal
Thu 18:36

I just don't get an honest feel from them
Thu 18:36

they're too sleezy
JubalEarly Thu 18:37

you think they really don't even have a check?
Thu 18:37

that'd be rough
River Thu 18:37

well we wouldn't be able to lynch them :D
Thu 18:37

because we know they're village right :D
Thu 18:37

funny storry
JubalEarly Thu 18:37

sorry very small side-note but with all these different win conditions I feel like its possible for no one to win, except for dead unrecruited villagers I guess...
River Thu 18:38

they said they wont tell us if they don't get the masons out
JubalEarly Thu 18:38

but with masons gone they have more voting power?
River Thu 18:38

guess they'd have to go with inq?
Thu 18:38

there's not a huge conflict there
Thu 18:38

they could just lynch the GV or what ever and be gucci
Thu 18:38

all happy
JubalEarly Thu 18:39

ya inq doesn't seem to have it too bad
River Thu 18:39

well their checks are basically irrelevant
Jayne Thu 18:39

On the outside chance this is just all people making it up, I will leave vote on sheriff. I just realized that is still very possible.
River Thu 18:39

because all that vamp stuff is non wc
Moderator Thu 18:39

Jayne votes to lynch SheriffBourne
River Thu 18:40

I think inq is just in it for another sub faction
Thu 18:40

I think the theme is clear by now
JubalEarly Thu 18:40

True. Pretty sure inq is just here to be a threat to some more village members
River Thu 18:40

it fits
JubalEarly Thu 18:40

^^ya that's how I feel about the theme
River Thu 18:40

devious setup
Thu 18:40

XD
JubalEarly Thu 18:40

definitely came to that conclusion in the midsts of pulling my hair out during the read-thru
Thu 18:41

like oh we all gotta kill each other and then also the vamps
Thu 18:41

I don't think I've ever been more happy to not be part of a subfaction
River Thu 18:41

that's why evil seems a bit underpowered this round
Thu 18:41

I said it above
JubalEarly Thu 18:41

I mean subfactions are basically the evil this round
River Thu 18:41

Illu's behavior balanced the game
Thu 18:41

this would have been a stomp probably
Thu 18:41

until today
Thu 18:42

now a "mason" has top voted
Thu 18:42

lol
Badger Thu 18:42

If I end being the one who is lynched I suggest you take a look at Zoe who still hasn't claimed and has been very lurky. Also I suggest you look at the masons vs. illu situation. Either could be a vamp basement, but I'm leaning towards that being the Masons. I trust that the illu lookout claim (I think it was Nandi?) as she saw me visiting Inara, however it's also possible that she is a fam stalker. I will most likely be afk for the rest of the day. And I also sus the GV claim - if you rolled reviver, why not revive Kaylee? Anyway. I will most likely be afk for the rest of the day. Good luck and good night.
Fanty Thu 18:42

It feels like tracey and op pushed far too hard for killing a mason RIGHT NOW, and it feels weird that a few others followed along with it so readily
JubalEarly Thu 18:42

we have MrU being like "look they gave us a vamp but lets lynch ML"
River Thu 18:42

that's why I'm kinda fighting for some odd justice today..
MrUniverse Thu 18:43

Im helping the Illuminati
River Thu 18:43

I don't really have a horse in this
MrUniverse Thu 18:43

since no-one wants to
Fanty Thu 18:43

I really really want people to realise how weird it is that we are so happy to lynch a mason that is confirmed by a fair few people
River Thu 18:43

but this feels shitty
MrUniverse Thu 18:43

they're not confirmed/
Thu 18:43

?
Thu 18:43

at all
JubalEarly Thu 18:43

I mean if we had to pick a subfaction to go with, I think illu is more strategic than masons
Thu 18:43

but I don't like em
Thu 18:43

so I gotta think it through
River Thu 18:43

yeah if they weren't totally dicks about it
Fanty Thu 18:44

Sorry, this is true MrU. Not all confirmed. but I still think killing vamps is way higher pirority
JubalEarly Thu 18:44

and I say more strategic cause of lookout and not needing the entire other faction wiped out
Fanty Thu 18:44

Why aren't illus happy to go for vamps and at least get rid of one basement entirely AND THEN we sort out the village since the village can all work together to help each other win
JubalEarly Thu 18:44

where masons wouldn't wanna stop till all illu are dead
MrUniverse Thu 18:44

well, i think you might be a vamp basement, so, another reason for my vote to be here
River Thu 18:44

if they said "yo illu here, we go those 2 vamp checks, maybe give us some masons as reward"
JubalEarly Thu 18:44

ya its like ok militia go shoot them
River Thu 18:44

MrUniverse, whos "you"?
JubalEarly Thu 18:45

mw go eat some mason chop
Thu 18:45

but all this fuckery
MrUniverse Thu 18:45

you = masons (not Kaylee)
JubalEarly Thu 18:45

feels like we're dealing with coven xD
Fanty Thu 18:45

MrU, I was recruited by mason last night, I proved my MW role as best I can, and I can kill another inactive tonight if THAT will put the issue to bed at last?
River Thu 18:45

ok thanks, would be nice if you dont eat me :D
Thu 18:45

thaaaanks <3
JubalEarly Thu 18:45

Zoe couldn't hurt imo
Thu 18:45

or you know what
Thu 18:46

sheriff should recruit and then you should eat him all in the same night
Thu 18:46

and then you get new ML with 2 new recruit
Thu 18:46

win win win
River Thu 18:46

lol
Thu 18:46

that's kinda goo
Thu 18:46

^d
Fanty Thu 18:46

Hahaha, not actually an awful idea lol
Jayne Thu 18:46

please kill me
Fanty Thu 18:47

Hold up
JubalEarly Thu 18:47

Jayne stay with us here
Thu 18:47

don't go into the light
Fanty Thu 18:47

If killing a mason makes the leader change and they can still get new recruits, THEN WHY IS KILLING A MASON AS A SHOW OF GOOD FAITH ANY USE AT AL
River Thu 18:47

no idea
Fanty Thu 18:47

It just means one less villlage member
River Thu 18:47

that shit makes no sense anyway
Fanty Thu 18:47

I still STILL do not understand
Thu 18:47

Rationing vamp info to the village in exchange for killing a mason that can just re-recruit the next day
River Thu 18:48

I as villager want as many villager alive as possible
Fanty Thu 18:48

It reduces village count by 1 permanently, to essentially no avail
River Thu 18:48

so I fight hard to not lynch villagers
Thu 18:48

because I don't see a benefit in it
MrUniverse Thu 18:48

I can't blame them for wanting to win
River Thu 18:48

it's kinda counterintuitive
JubalEarly Thu 18:48

I mean ya everyone wants to win
Fanty Thu 18:48

Mr U, neither can. But the masons just rerecruit the next day anyways
River Thu 18:48

I still think they are blackmailing us
JubalEarly Thu 18:49

It feels that way
Fanty Thu 18:49

It just lessens villagers and gives vamps more time
Thu 18:49

VAMPS SHOULD BE PRIORITY
JubalEarly Thu 18:49

just leaves a bad taste in the mouth
Thu 18:49

like maybe give us anything else even
Thu 18:49

have nandi reveal her checks or some shit
MrUniverse Thu 18:49

unless, and hear me out, the masons didnt recruit again?
JubalEarly Thu 18:49

but like noooo we NEED this or else
Thu 18:49

and its like comeoooon
Thu 18:49

you help us we help you
Thu 18:49

could be civil
River Thu 18:49

seriously, don't watch them tonight
Thu 18:49

they wont tell us anyway
MrUniverse Thu 18:50

i like how, they give checks, want something in return, people dont give it, and demand more things
River Thu 18:50

I feel they'll just keep it for themselves anyway
JubalEarly Thu 18:50

ya and it definitely sounded like they were going to tell us other vamp tomorrow
Thu 18:50

but recently Tracey said she was waiting until only 1 mason?
River Thu 18:50

I said that
Thu 18:50

they changed that during the day
Thu 18:50

I refuse to suck their ...
Thu 18:50

just to get that check
Thu 18:50

we can probably win the game without them before that
JubalEarly Thu 18:50

ya I mean if they decided to actively help us its like a show of good faith
River Thu 18:50

just by verifying everything else
JubalEarly Thu 18:51

like I get they have different win cons
River Thu 18:51

they're kinda no concern of mine though
JubalEarly Thu 18:51

not just gonna be like "oh you helped us, f you though, masons rule, illu drool"
Thu 18:51

I mean now its kinda like that
Thu 18:52

but only cause of all the bs
River Thu 18:52

sorry but we can verify masons
Thu 18:52

and with a backup ML
JubalEarly Thu 18:52

the thing that upsets me the most is that they didn't say anything D3
River Thu 18:52

they have more potential than illu
Fanty Thu 18:52

I don't think any villagers would have a problem with co-ordinating to kill all masons but 1 once vampires are more under control just so they can get to their arbitrary win condition of 1 mason or less alive
River Thu 18:52

SO I don't get why we side with the weaker faction
Fanty Thu 18:52

Would any villager honestly mind just co-ordinating to work that out once vamps were found and killed more
JubalEarly Thu 18:52

we were like so sure Book was fam
River Thu 18:52

I dont wanna deal with losers
JubalEarly Thu 18:53

and then they can confirm and be like "ya also he had a non-lethal visit from xxx"
River Thu 18:53

jupp
JubalEarly Thu 18:53

and then its like cool we found the vm and the fam
River Thu 18:53

that's the most telling thing
Thu 18:53

them hiding that info
JubalEarly Thu 18:53

and ml was dead so they shoulda been happy
Thu 18:53

like that's real low imo
Thu 18:54

when we could had vm and fam so early
River Thu 18:54

that would be like me not revealing info about kaylee, just because I'm inq or what evs.
Thu 18:54

Just not how I play
Thu 18:54

and I find it really sleezy
JubalEarly Thu 18:55

ya doesn't really wanna make people work with you
Thu 18:55

so now we're here cause of all that
River Thu 18:55

with 9:/
Thu 18:55

9:9
Thu 18:55

yaaay
JubalEarly Thu 18:55

any idea who hasn't voted?
River Thu 18:55

oh boy
JubalEarly Thu 18:56

stitch?
River Thu 18:56

Badger=9 (SheriffBourne, Higgins, Fanty, River, Wash, Monty, Niska, Zoe, JubalEarly), Mal=1 (Fess), SheriffBourne=9 (Simon, Operative, Tracey, Nandi, Badger, Mal, Jayne, MrUniverse, DrCaron)
JubalEarly Thu 18:57

yeah its our boi stitch
River Thu 18:57

and?
Thu 18:57

aren't 2 missin?
MrUniverse Thu 18:57

fess
JubalEarly Thu 18:57

thats 19 votes
MrUniverse Thu 18:57

whos on mal
JubalEarly Thu 18:57

9 9 and 1
River Thu 18:58

oh yeah
JubalEarly Thu 18:58

Fes
River Thu 18:58

hey fesss, fess up and vote
Thu 18:58

someone useful
JubalEarly Thu 18:59

like they're trying to force this lynch so hard
Thu 18:59

and its on a villager...
River Thu 18:59

sorry but I dont buy the vamp thing, they wouldn't go for vamp
JubalEarly Thu 18:59

like to them its an evil villager but like ok why don't we let vamps kill us while we kill villagers
River Thu 18:59

they need several DAYS to get rid of all the masons
Thu 19:00

thats why I think we wont get that supposed vamp check any time soon
JubalEarly Thu 19:00

Fanty so are you not going to kill Illu or what though?
Thu 19:00

like if its your win condition for them to all be gone
Thu 19:00

cause we're really gonna f ourselves over with this
Thu 19:00

like everyone is like its my win condition I need to do it and then we all lose except for vamp
Thu 19:01

technically everyone can win
Thu 19:01

If all illu die and one mason left alive
Thu 19:01

then everyone is happy except for vamps
Thu 19:01

like we have 2 MWs, maybe? Killing ourselves can't be too hard after getting down to one vamp
River Thu 19:02

I find it funny how illus don't vote the vamp
Thu 19:02

that's such a big fuck you to everyone
JubalEarly Thu 19:02

ya its not like there's 1 vamp left
River Thu 19:02

that's why I don't trust them one bit
JubalEarly Thu 19:02

but lets let there be 2 evil night kills tonight
Thu 19:02

why not
Fanty Thu 19:02

I'm torn. I'd like to hear from Sheriff and likely Niska tonight in the mason chat to hear what the FUCK this discord mess is about
Thu 19:03

I'm also happy to not kill if we don't know a vamp. I'd like to not further sour villager faction relations by eating illus, even though they seem to want us to
River Thu 19:03

@Jurbal you know what would be funny
JubalEarly Thu 19:03

like if sheriff gets lynched, vamps kill 2-3 people tonight, maybe another militia goes wild
Thu 19:03

and before we know it vamps are burning our houses down
Fanty Thu 19:03

This is exactly the crux of this all. Why not kill a vamp that has a lot of evidence suggesting they are vamp? Why NOT vote them?
Thu 19:04

Masons won't be down to 1 for several days.
JubalEarly Thu 19:04

cause you think you need to get your way before you can help anyone
River Thu 19:04

If Higgins is evil. just threw out a bullshit check on operative and both vamp basements know the other one is talking fake shit :D
JubalEarly Thu 19:04

-_-
River Thu 19:04

but obviously nobody would say
JubalEarly Thu 19:04

that would be something lol
Thu 19:04

like vamps work together better than this village
River Thu 19:04

not hard
Thu 19:05

to do that
Thu 19:05

I mean both wouldn't reveal
Fanty Thu 19:05

I just refuse to believe that they don't see vamps as a bigger priority. Either they have a spite-boner against masons or they are vamps. Locking vamp info behind a villager death (especially when masons can just recruit again the next night), is VERY sus behavious
River Thu 19:05

would out both sides
Fanty Thu 19:05

Gatekeeping vamp info in exchange for an essentially meaningless mason lynch is absoulltely bonkers
JubalEarly Thu 19:05

I think its the 'spite-boner' as you say
Thu 19:06

I don't mean to throw blows but it just feels childish. Like they need to get their way before they can help
MrUniverse Thu 19:06

sounds like a lot of people here
JubalEarly Thu 19:07

just cause the play is child-ish doesn't mean the people are. We all think differently about what the best ways to go about something
Fanty Thu 19:07

MrU, would you concede that hiding info from village in exchange for mason deaths (especially when the deaths can be undone by a further mason recruit the next night), is at best nonsensical, and at worst spiteful or the actions of vampires?
Thu 19:07

Do you agree with that?
JubalEarly Thu 19:08

if you lie its perjury
MrUniverse Thu 19:08

if you're just going to make more masons, then their play makes even more sense
Fanty Thu 19:08

Because if you don't MrU, I'm happy to discuss why it's not silly
MrUniverse Thu 19:08

if they need to bring you down to 1
Fanty Thu 19:08

MrU, it only makes sense to kill masons if you are vampires.
MrUniverse Thu 19:08

or the illuminati
JubalEarly Thu 19:08

ok but why not help everyone and then we can work together to find the best way for everyone to get what they want
Thu 19:09

like illuminati give us info and masons agree not to recruit
Thu 19:09

like that'd be nice
MrUniverse Thu 19:09

because they think everyone wont help them, based on what theyve said earlier
JubalEarly Thu 19:09

cause the more people that get into subfactions the worse this going to get
MrUniverse Thu 19:09

considering where we are right now, i cant blame them for that view
JubalEarly Thu 19:09

I don't want to help them because they're putting us through this instead of working together
Fanty Thu 19:09

Okay here's my breakdown of it. Get the vamps under control, work out who is the vamp master of the final basement, AND THEN and only then, co-ordinate killing the villagers in the right proportions. Until this happens, the vamps can scupper plans however they want. That way, once villagers are down to the correct amounts, we lynch the final VM and game ends with all win conditions met for village
JubalEarly Thu 19:10

yaaaay
Thu 19:10

Vamps just like "I don't like that very much"
Thu 19:10

he'd be like our pet vampire that goes out and kills one of us every night but its ok
Fanty Thu 19:10

MrU, since villagers can just happily co-ordinate the mason deaths in the right proportions once the vamps are under control, the illu and mason win conditions seem kinda arbitrary, since they are easy to organise once vamps are udner control
Thu 19:11

Is there a flaw in that reasoning anywhere?
MrUniverse Thu 19:11

the flaw is, I'm of the opinion the mason claim is nonsense anyway
JubalEarly Thu 19:11

I mean its kind of ideal to have it work out that nicely
MrUniverse Thu 19:11

So, while your theory does have merit, i don't think you're masons
Fanty Thu 19:11

And explain why?
JubalEarly Thu 19:12

based on everything that's happened, masons make a lot of sense
Thu 19:12

like Sheriff and Niska didn't know there were 4 illu out there when they claimed
Thu 19:12

so its not like they fake claimed something that "makes sense"
Thu 19:12

in fact
Thu 19:12

it made very little sense
Thu 19:12

(at the time)
MrUniverse Thu 19:13

the nature of how they claimed
Thu 19:13

sobering up mid-conversation about how we don't trust them
Fanty Thu 19:13

I posted my recruitment message, I've proved my MW role as best I can by eating the minimum amount of people and they were inactives that I ate
JubalEarly Thu 19:13

I mean lets consider they're telling the truth for a second
Thu 19:13

there's not a great way to claim tht
MrUniverse Thu 19:13

this new "mason apprentice" role, messages on discord, this sudden new win condition
JubalEarly Thu 19:13

@Fanty unfortunately you proving your maple-ness doesn't help this argument
Thu 19:14

since Masons or Vamps could have recruited you
MrUniverse Thu 19:14

it's like everytime anyone suspects them, or wants to kill one of them, another layer gets added
JubalEarly Thu 19:14

and thats what we're debating
Thu 19:14

if they are masons or vamp
Fanty Thu 19:14

We also have Dr sobering up into a MW and Monty who used their militia shot for no good reason on an inactive player, are you sus of them too?
MrUniverse Thu 19:14

monty shot an inactive player. That was something that was discussed
Thu 19:15

Dr sobered up and stuck with their claim
Thu 19:15

they havent added anything to it, or said they got super secret messages on discord
Thu 19:15

so, i believe them more
Fanty Thu 19:15

I have to say, I'm confused by sheriff's discord stuff, and I don't like that that sort of out of game meta stuff isn't allowed to be discussed properly in game, so Iw ill have to ask about that tonight
JubalEarly Thu 19:15

ok but lets imagine that inq, illu, and 3 VMs are in this game
Thu 19:15

you think changing masons like this is super unreasonable?
Thu 19:16

it makes it into a brawl of the village with also the vamp threat looming over us
Thu 19:16

like we def need to work together to get that under control first
Fanty Thu 19:16

But I want you to explain why WHY in a game where 3/4 drunks have sobered up into VILLAGE roles, that you think lynching more village is a better idea than a likely vamp badger
MrUniverse Thu 19:16

with 3 vms? seems a bit much
JubalEarly Thu 19:16

or vamps just steamroll us
Thu 19:16

in a game with 30 people?
MrUniverse Thu 19:16

i don't think 3/4 drunks did sober into village roles
Fanty Thu 19:16

It seems as though village lost a lot of villagers early on and the drunks had to be given to village to balance the game more
Thu 19:17

Also true, they might be lying.
JubalEarly Thu 19:17

also if there are only 2 VMs then River is right
MrUniverse Thu 19:17

again, looping back to "I don't believe the masons"
JubalEarly Thu 19:17

and masons can't be vamp
MrUniverse Thu 19:17

why?
Thu 19:17

Badger could be familiar, right?
JubalEarly Thu 19:17

since Illu supposedly know the two VMs
Thu 19:17

I mean he'd admitted to killing twice I think?
MrUniverse Thu 19:17

I thought they knew Badger and whoever visited Book?
JubalEarly Thu 19:17

either MW or vamp, don't see it being a fam
MrUniverse Thu 19:18

MW into Fam?
JubalEarly Thu 19:18

oof
Thu 19:18

maybe
Thu 19:18

that'd be rough
MrUniverse Thu 19:18

hence our drunk roling into mw
JubalEarly Thu 19:18

but still worth the lynch
MrUniverse Thu 19:18

*rolling
JubalEarly Thu 19:18

like he's fam or VM for sure, why not lynch him
Thu 19:18

higgins or some shit can maybe prove masons tomorrow
Thu 19:19

and then we work together
Thu 19:19

in harmony
Thu 19:19

kum ba ya
Thu 19:19

except vamps
Thu 19:19

they can f off
MrUniverse Thu 19:19

i'd rather just deal with the "masons", then the Illuminati will help with their remaining check
Thu 19:20

seems the easiest way of getting the information
JubalEarly Thu 19:20

deal with them by killing one of them and finding out they were lit so they recruited another person who now needs illu dead and they also probably spite kill an illu with their mw
Thu 19:20

and then 2-3 deaths from Vamps tonight
Fanty Thu 19:20

*sigh* Killing. Masons. Means. Less. Villagers.
JubalEarly Thu 19:21

and we're looking at like 10 villagers with most of them needing the other half dead
Thu 19:21

like thats a good place to end up
Thu 19:21

/s
Tracey Thu 19:21

no you're just swapping 3 masons for 3 illuminati
Thu 19:21

2 masons really
Thu 19:21

we can leave 1 alive
Thu 19:21

at the minute you dont have our support
Fanty Thu 19:21

WE DONT WANT TO SWAP VILLAGE FOR VILLAGE
MrUniverse Thu 19:21

if the masons recruit, then thats on them
Tracey Thu 19:21

because we are not able to give it to you
MrUniverse Thu 19:21

they know the illuminati want to leave 1 left
JubalEarly Thu 19:21

I mean ofc they're going to recruit if you start killing them
MrUniverse Thu 19:21

if they recruit another villager, that;s their fault
Thu 19:21

why?
JubalEarly Thu 19:22

ok and that one is supposed to be like "ok im gonna lose but ill help"
Tracey Thu 19:22

why would they though they win with us
Thu 19:22

no they win with us
MrUniverse Thu 19:22

^that
JubalEarly Thu 19:22

what
Fanty Thu 19:22

'their fault'. They also want to play the game, and until the vbamps are under control, then villagers are going to be at a massive disadvantage
Tracey Thu 19:22

masons win if village win
JubalEarly Thu 19:22

um
Fanty Thu 19:22

Read my above suggestion tracey and MrU, can you explain what is wrong with that plan?
JubalEarly Thu 19:22

you were here for the new mason win con right?
Fanty Thu 19:22

Okay here's my breakdown of it. Get the vamps under control, work out who is the vamp master of the final basement, AND THEN and only then, co-ordinate killing the villagers in the right proportions. Until this happens, the vamps can scupper plans however they want. That way, once villagers are down to the correct amounts, we lynch the final VM and game ends with all win conditions met for village
Thu 19:22

since villagers can just happily co-ordinate the mason deaths in the right proportions once the vamps are under control, the illu and mason win conditions seem kinda arbitrary, since they are easy to organise once vamps are udner control Thu 19:11 Is there a flaw in that reasoning anywhere?
MrUniverse Thu 19:23

their new win condition is another reason i dont believe them
Tracey Thu 19:23

The reason we cant do that Fanty is it leaves us open to losing
Thu 19:23

as soon as vamps are found nobody is going to be interested in helping illuminati win
JubalEarly Thu 19:23

and killing each other for 2 days doesn't leave us open to losing??
Fanty Thu 19:23

In exactly the same way that it leaves us open to losing.
MrUniverse Thu 19:23

but at this point, im talking in circles. And i have a couple of things to do. So, im gonna leave for a couple of hours. Should be back before nightfall
Tracey Thu 19:23

no it does
Thu 19:23

doesnt
Thu 19:23

its very different
Fanty Thu 19:23

How? the village could kill us just like they could kill you?
Thu 19:24

Please explain, I am genuinely curious
JubalEarly Thu 19:24

ya no one wants the illu to win cause you guys have been hindering us the whole game instead of working together
Thu 19:24

like you could just turn it around
Fanty Thu 19:24

Do you not think your win killing masons win condition is arbitrary since we can easily organise it once the vamps are under control?
JubalEarly Thu 19:24

get some good faith for you guys going
Tracey Thu 19:24

It's not about killing us, it's about killing vamps. As soon as we give the information that leads to a village win then we lose if we haven't got our win condition
Thu 19:24

we could organise it but people wont
Thu 19:24

why would they at that point
JubalEarly Thu 19:24

knowing another VM won't just suddenly kill off all the vamps
Tracey Thu 19:24

Unfortunately we have to do this objective first
Fanty Thu 19:24

Tracey, you are locking info behind mason kills. It is the definition of blackmail
JubalEarly Thu 19:25

cause you helped?
Tracey Thu 19:25

that wont happen though will it
JubalEarly Thu 19:25

because you aren't helping!!
Tracey Thu 19:25

no im just pursuing the objectives in the correct order
Fanty Thu 19:25

You can say it is not, but look up the definition: force (someone) to do something by using threats or manipulating their feelings.
Tracey Thu 19:25

ive been very open and wanting to cooperate
Thu 19:25

and i feel like we can make a village win for all factions
JubalEarly Thu 19:25

what about D3 when you realized you found a VM and were sure the ML was dead?
Tracey Thu 19:25

including masons
JubalEarly Thu 19:26

Tracey you all need to be dead for masons to win
Fanty Thu 19:26

Tracey, you don't HAVE to do it first. You simply don't. We can get vamps down to one VM and keep him as our pet, THEN co-ordinate the villlage to kill the masons one at a time
JubalEarly Thu 19:26

does your plan include all the illu dying
Tracey Thu 19:26

Jubal thats according to them and their insane discord theory
Thu 19:26

which i do not buy
Fanty Thu 19:26

You realise that if both masons and illus acted in the way you did, village categorically cannot win? yes?
Tracey Thu 19:26

I am going off the rules in how to play
JubalEarly Thu 19:26

if you don't buy it then there aren't even masons to begin with
Tracey Thu 19:26

hopefully not
Thu 19:27

if we kill sherrif and dig him as evil
Thu 19:27

then great, floodgates open
Thu 19:27

and remember if they are telling the truth - we kill sherrif they have a god damn BACKUP ML
JubalEarly Thu 19:27

and if he's not then you hold your info until 2 more masons are dead? (because they are surely recruiting if sheriff dies)
Thu 19:27

which makes us extra fucked
Fanty Thu 19:27

Tracey, explain to me how to resolve this. If masons and illus need each other dead to win, and neither wants to kill vamps and instead just focuses on the their villager subfaction, THEN VAMPS WIN
Tracey Thu 19:27

we would hope they wouldnt recruit, so that they can go down to one easily and we can work together to find the vamps
JubalEarly Thu 19:28

the more people in the village that need the other half of the village dead make it unwinnable for anyone except for vamps
Tracey Thu 19:28

Fanty i do not believe masons need illu dead to win
Fanty Thu 19:28

Tracey, you can't honestly HONESTLY believe that reasoning? This is literally ransom
Tracey Thu 19:28

that is not stated in how to play
JubalEarly Thu 19:28

Tracey there's only two possibilities
Thu 19:28

If they are lit, they won't go down to 1
Fanty Thu 19:28

You are giving vamps AT LEAST 2 more nights to kill villagers before you will even REVEAL a vamp
JubalEarly Thu 19:28

because they need illu dead
Fanty Thu 19:28

You won't even VOTE FOR A VAMP TONIGHT
Thu 19:28

None of your stuff makes sense man
Tracey Thu 19:28

It makes complete sense if you need masons dead first
Thu 19:29

which we do
JubalEarly Thu 19:29

there's no situation in which masons just say ok we'll let you kill us off cause we can all win
Fanty Thu 19:29

It doesn't. The vamp will just go into a familiar and we are no further forward
JubalEarly Thu 19:29

masons have their win con just like you
Thu 19:29

try viewing it in their eyes for a second
Tracey Thu 19:29

masons win condition is village wins
JubalEarly Thu 19:29

ok last time
Thu 19:29

if they are lit
Tracey Thu 19:29

its not for illuminati to die
JubalEarly Thu 19:29

then so is their win con
Thu 19:29

they wouldn't make it up
Tracey Thu 19:29

https://werewolv.es/guides/how-to-play-online-werewolf
JubalEarly Thu 19:29

ffs
Tracey Thu 19:29

this is what we are playing to
JubalEarly Thu 19:29

im done
Fanty Thu 19:30

Tracey, this is information ransom.
Tracey Thu 19:30

so let me understand this
Thu 19:30

fanty
Operative Thu 19:30

Jut reading back and I'm with Jayne, if the rules change mid game for it to be 'interesting' i am also annoyed at how much time I've spent on this today. Like what's the point. So I have to assume the masons are lying or that the game was fucked and I wasted a lot of time today
Fanty Thu 19:30

You are hiding vamp info behind the death of masons. Death of villagers.
Tracey Thu 19:30

Fanty answer me this
Thu 19:30

what would you do as illuminati at this point
Fanty Thu 19:30

I definitely concede that what sheriff is implying is weird af and that out of game meta or discord stuff should be more publicly explained
Thu 19:30

Tracey, I've explained what I would do multiple times.
Operative Thu 19:31

The idea that a mason team with 2 members, both of whom can be leaders and another one that can be revived against a Illu team with 1 leader is so broken
Thu 19:31

So I have to assume they are lying or this game is pointless
Fanty Thu 19:31

Get vamps udner control, elucidate who is the final VM and keep them alive until we have the villagers down to the requisite numbers for all the win conditions
Tracey Thu 19:31

you would "trust" that everyone is going to find out the people they need to kill to win, but put that on pause to help some others
Thu 19:31

i just dont believe that will happen
JubalEarly Thu 19:31

before drunks sobered up there were 4 illu
Thu 19:31

with 0 masons
SheriffBourne Thu 19:31

I'm here for a short moment. Our win condition is different than usual indeed. I want to state the following about this: either we didn't speak about it and still acted on it, by killing Illuminati, and you'd be even more pissed because you didn't have the info out there. Now you are mad or disbelieving of the info I present to you, and it might not've been in my best interest to share it with you, but at least it made the playing field more level, in terms of the info evereyone has.
Operative Thu 19:31

so?
JubalEarly Thu 19:31

and you guys still didn't give us shit
Operative Thu 19:31

Why is that bad?
Tracey Thu 19:31

because of mason incompetence
Fanty Thu 19:31

Sheriff
SheriffBourne Thu 19:31

I don't necessarily like the whole mason situation, but it was what I was given.
Operative Thu 19:32

we only got badger last night
Fanty Thu 19:32

PLEASE explain this. Did you get discord messages saying the win condition changed? wtf is htis
Thu 19:32

this
SheriffBourne Thu 19:32

Blaming current Masons for stuff the first ML did is stupid, Tracey.
Thu 19:32

We have zero links.
JubalEarly Thu 19:32

^
Thu 19:32

doesn't matter who's incompetence it was
Tracey Thu 19:32

no im just saying that the OG masons made a mistake, thats that
SheriffBourne Thu 19:32

I will say that Discord messages are not essential to this.
JubalEarly Thu 19:32

illu was basically powered up masons until drunks sobered up
Operative Thu 19:32

Yeah because it's even when you have a killing role and know who we all are because we had no idea anyone needed us dead
Thu 19:32

seems fair
SheriffBourne Thu 19:32

If a Moderator wants to message a player or some subgroup, they can.
JubalEarly Thu 19:32

and still didn't give us anything
Tracey Thu 19:32

Sherrif you weren't even sure that there were illuminati
SheriffBourne Thu 19:33

So it's possible, hypothetically speaking, that Masons got a message about their updated objectives.
Tracey Thu 19:33

and stated as such
SheriffBourne Thu 19:33

Yes, because I've said so before
JubalEarly Thu 19:33

like imagine this
Thu 19:33

you know who a VM is
SheriffBourne Thu 19:33

The hypothetical message wouldn't necessarily have to state that there ARE Illuminati
JubalEarly Thu 19:33

there are 0 masons
Tracey Thu 19:33

even though you now tell us you had a message saying this is your objectiuve
Fanty Thu 19:33

Sheriff, I really need something more concrete. I find it hard to believe Mod would take you out the game for confirming to us that our literal win condition had changed
JubalEarly Thu 19:33

but still lets keep quiet
Operative Thu 19:33

we gave you a vamp today, illu want to lay low if possible
JubalEarly Thu 19:33

because
Thu 19:33

???
SheriffBourne Thu 19:33

it would have said: if there are Illuminati, you have to kill them
Thu 19:33

it's a conditional statement
Tracey Thu 19:33

right but they didnt tell the illuminati that
Operative Thu 19:33

so what do we claim when asked?
Thu 19:34

We have to lie? We don't even know anyone wants us dead?!
JubalEarly Thu 19:34

you claim illu and give us the vm???
SheriffBourne Thu 19:34

Tracey, that is beef you have with the mod, and I agree that you should have been informed
Tracey Thu 19:34

and we happily reveal ourselves because the rules in HTP say nobody needs to specifically claim
JubalEarly Thu 19:34

when there were 0 masons
SheriffBourne Thu 19:34

but that's not my position
Thu 19:34

I have explained it to you, publicly.
Tracey Thu 19:34

im point it out because i think its bullshit
JubalEarly Thu 19:34

you had a chance and still didn't even bother to help
Tracey Thu 19:34

and the mod wouldnt do that
Operative Thu 19:34

We have helped
Thu 19:34

We gave you a vamp today
JubalEarly Thu 19:34

im not talking about fucking badger today
Operative Thu 19:34

Tracey wasn't illu until last night
JubalEarly Thu 19:34

im talking about when you knew ml was dead
Operative Thu 19:34

so we didnt know as illu
SheriffBourne Thu 19:34

Is there anymore info I can give?
Operative Thu 19:35

That's tracey's info he held ontp
SheriffBourne Thu 19:35

I wish to help with whatever info I can give, but will not invest into this emotional hell hole
JubalEarly Thu 19:35

ok why the hell didn't she claim it yesterday?
Operative Thu 19:35

He didn't realise it meant the person was a vamp
JubalEarly Thu 19:35

if she wasn't even illu
Tracey Thu 19:35

I knew yesterday i was illu
JubalEarly Thu 19:35

and she had a vm check
Operative Thu 19:35

until we said the fam got dug
JubalEarly Thu 19:35

and you also knew ML was dead
Operative Thu 19:35

he didn't realise he found a vamp
Thu 19:35

until last night
Tracey Thu 19:35

I hadnt seen the night chat until evening
Operative Thu 19:35

So we only know we have two vamps LAST NIGHT
Tracey Thu 19:35

I was not aware the dig on book
Operative Thu 19:35

we caught badger because he killed one of us
Fanty Thu 19:35

Op, you didn't give us a vamp today, someone gave it against your wishes. You can't paint yourselves as willing to cooperate if you want to kill villagers before giving vamp info in a time-sensitive situation where vamps would grow in number AND kill more villagers
Operative Thu 19:36

Nandi is on our team
Thu 19:36

So we gave you a vamp
JubalEarly Thu 19:36

ya I seem to remember you saying you didn't want to give the check
Thu 19:36

lol ya you're so helpful
Thu 19:36

thanks for choosing to help us
SheriffBourne Thu 19:36

It seems my part has been played here, as in: there's no more info I need to give. And perhaps I'll even be lynched.
Tracey Thu 19:36

please post that
SheriffBourne Thu 19:36

So I'll leave.
Operative Thu 19:36

Wow
SheriffBourne Thu 19:36

Have a good night, all of you.
Operative Thu 19:36

You got your vamp what else do you want
JubalEarly Thu 19:36

the other vamp???
Operative Thu 19:37

NO
Thu 19:37

Tomorrow
Thu 19:37

get over it
JubalEarly Thu 19:37

lol ya cause you aren't helpful
Thu 19:37

not if tracey has anything to say about it im sure
Thu 19:37

no we need to wait till there's 1 mason
Thu 19:37

so lets let vamps kill us while we try to get there
Thu 19:37

and you can just hold on to who's doing the killing
Thu 19:37

we don't need to knopw
Thu 19:37

we'll know once we're all dead and vamp wins
Operative Thu 19:37

How would you knowing help right now?
Thu 19:38

I'm curious, you get one lynch a day right?
Thu 19:38

You're lynching a vamp now
Thu 19:38

Why do you NEED to know another RIGHT NOW?
JubalEarly Thu 19:38

because I don't trust you'd tell us tomorrow
Thu 19:38

we need to know in general
Operative Thu 19:38

You can't kill them at night
Fanty Thu 19:38

Tracey and Op, please, slowly and calmly explain why killing villagers in a time sensitive game with limited kills and lycnhes available, that we should kill masons before vamps. Vamps grow, have more info than us, and can kill multiple villagers per night
Thu 19:38

Please, explain to me why we shouldn't lynch a vamp when we can
JubalEarly Thu 19:38

Op, if you die and tracey has her way, she's not going to out the other vamp
Operative Thu 19:38

I'm so done with this game, illu shafted or vamps great mason play
JubalEarly Thu 19:38

so then we're left twiddling our thumbs
Fanty Thu 19:39

tracey or op, explain the bit above?
JubalEarly Thu 19:39

its not that we need to know tonight
Thu 19:39

its that there's 0 evidence so far that you guys would be willing to help us at all
Thu 19:39

unless Nandi goes against your wishes and is actually decent
Operative Thu 19:39

I honestly don't care
Tracey Thu 19:39

We need there to be 1 mason left first
Thu 19:39

or else we lose
Fanty Thu 19:39

Nandi revealed the vamp against your wishes, but you've painted it as you doing us a favour, when in reality, you're ransomming the village for mason deaths in exchange for revealing a vamp
Tracey Thu 19:39

thats the bottom line
Operative Thu 19:39

All everyone has done all day is attack us for trying to play in our team's best interests
JubalEarly Thu 19:40

maybe we'd be more inclined to think of a way to get there if you guys showed any help at all
Fanty Thu 19:40

No, not for that, we understand that. You play in vamp's interests too much
Operative Thu 19:40

We gave you a vamp
JubalEarly Thu 19:40

what's in your best interest is working with the village
Operative Thu 19:40

jesus christ
Tracey Thu 19:40

then help us faster
JubalEarly Thu 19:40

building trust
Thu 19:40

not this shit
Thu 19:40

instead we're just stuck killing each other while vamps get off easy
Operative Thu 19:40

You don't build any trust with us
JubalEarly Thu 19:41

??? what
Operative Thu 19:41

You threaten to kill us, masons come out and say they want us all dead
Fanty Thu 19:41

Tracey, Operative, explain now WHY you would rather use a valuable lynch on a mason instead of on a vamp that you yourselves have confirmed?
Thu 19:41

Explain why your votes remain on a mason that will probably just re-recruit, INSTEAD OF A CONFIRMED VAMP
Thu 19:41

Can you explain this?
Operative Thu 19:41

Because I want to kill masons
JubalEarly Thu 19:41

you say it like you guys weren't saying that you wanted all but one of them dead
Fanty Thu 19:41

No, no I don't want to kill you
Tracey Thu 19:41

we would ask they dont re-recruit because we will be another day further
JubalEarly Thu 19:41

how dare they say that they want you dead
Operative Thu 19:41

And for me to be ok with this game, the masons have to be lying
Thu 19:41

Because otherwise I wanna quit
JubalEarly Thu 19:42

so you are asking them to lose Tracey?
Tracey Thu 19:42

THEY DONT LOSE
Fanty Thu 19:42

lmao love how unacceptable you find people wanting you dead when it's literally 1) the point of the game, and 2) when you want them dead in return
Tracey Thu 19:42

jesus
Thu 19:42

how often do we have to go over this
JubalEarly Thu 19:42

Tracey how do you not get this
Thu 19:42

if they are lit
Thu 19:42

then they aren't lying
Tracey Thu 19:42

right so let's find out if they are lit
Fanty Thu 19:42

Tracey, can you explain why Sheriff would make up somethign so bizarre and new? what game purpose would that serve?
Operative Thu 19:42

It doesn't matter, masons or illu have to die for either to win and by the looks of it everyone sides with masons
Tracey Thu 19:42

this exact scenario?
Operative Thu 19:42

Vamps, need any help lads?
Fanty Thu 19:42

How would it help the masons to want the illus all dead?
JubalEarly Thu 19:43

everyone is siding with the masons cause the illu is blackmailing us
Operative Thu 19:43

That's your win condition apparently
JubalEarly Thu 19:43

that's how everyone has felt about this
Tracey Thu 19:43

not everyone
Operative Thu 19:43

How are we blackmailing you
JubalEarly Thu 19:43

ya not the vamps probably
Tracey Thu 19:43

9 people are voting for sherrif
Operative Thu 19:43

You have a vamp lynch for today
Fanty Thu 19:43

Yes it is apparently, I get that this is weird, but I also can't come up with a reason that sheriffw ould make this shit up
Operative Thu 19:43

Stop crying
Tracey Thu 19:43

well lets lynch, confirm and find out
JubalEarly Thu 19:43

lol telling me to stop crying?
Tracey Thu 19:43

then we know where we stand and we can work it out so we all win
Fanty Thu 19:43

We DON'T have a vamp lynch yet, your vote remains on a mason instead of confirmed vamp
JubalEarly Thu 19:43

I could go back and quote so many things
Tracey Thu 19:43

let's lynch sherrif to find out if they are evil
Operative Thu 19:44

Yes everyone whining about the vamp check is so boring
Tracey Thu 19:44

dig him up, get it confirmed
Thu 19:44

still have another ML for gods sake
Thu 19:44

then we can take it from there
JubalEarly Thu 19:44

What about you guys whining about how 2 masons are so unfair
Operative Thu 19:44

Quote away, my investment in this game is so low at this point
Tracey Thu 19:44

meanwhile we'll discuss tonight how to get the vamp info out in a way which means we dont lose
JubalEarly Thu 19:44

4 illu as of yesterday and you complain about 2 masons appearing
Tracey Thu 19:44

2 ML
Operative Thu 19:44

Yeah three ML potential = 4 illu
Thu 19:44

LOL
Thu 19:44

So balanced
Tracey Thu 19:44

not mason
Thu 19:44

mason LEADERS
Thu 19:45

who can each recruit 2 people
Operative Thu 19:45

A ML and a ML apprentice
Tracey Thu 19:45

and refreshed on sunday
Operative Thu 19:45

ARE YOU KIDDING ME
Tracey Thu 19:45

and someone in the GY
Thu 19:45

who could be revived
Thu 19:45

and refreshed
Thu 19:45

to recruit even more masons
Thu 19:45

we dont want this
Fanty Thu 19:45

Guys, you clearly can't or won't be reasoned with
JubalEarly Thu 19:45

well you had it easy until then. It becomes a challenge and suddenly life is so unfair
Tracey Thu 19:45

we have been very reasonable and have offered a very reasonable solution
JubalEarly Thu 19:45

not how do we go about this
Fanty Thu 19:45

Nothing is changing your mind, even just asking you to slowly explain stuff, you just respond with variants on 'we want masons dead'
JubalEarly Thu 19:46

lets just complain and withhold information until village does what we want
Operative Thu 19:46

How is this challenging? Masons want us dead - we have no killing power and no more recruits
Tracey Thu 19:46

there is no other way we can win
Operative Thu 19:46

We lose
Tracey Thu 19:46

so we need masons dead
Thu 19:46

that is step one
Fanty Thu 19:46

This discussion has been frustrating and pointless.
Operative Thu 19:46

The thing is we aren't telling the village to do anything
Thu 19:46

We're just voting
Fanty Thu 19:46

You kill the masons, we have 2/3 less villagers which could be crucial
Operative Thu 19:46

Kill who you want
JubalEarly Thu 19:46

lol we're not telling you what to do but if you want to find the evils then do what we want
Thu 19:46

k
Tracey Thu 19:46

we are asking you
JubalEarly Thu 19:46

that is 100% the situation
Tracey Thu 19:46

and suggesting we work together
Operative Thu 19:47

You have a seer, you'll be fine
Thu 19:47

I'm struggling to grasp why we should help you if you won't help us
Thu 19:47

?
JubalEarly Thu 19:47

I don't even know how that's relevant
Operative Thu 19:47

I liked it earlier today when everyone worked together
JubalEarly Thu 19:47

you guys refused to help us until Nandi appeared
Operative Thu 19:47

So?
JubalEarly Thu 19:47

and were angry at her
Thu 19:47

you didn't want to help us at all
Operative Thu 19:47

So?
JubalEarly Thu 19:47

and suddenly we should be helping you
Operative Thu 19:48

No I want to know WHY we should help you
JubalEarly Thu 19:48

if you don't understand how that's hypocritical I'm not gonna bother arguing it
Operative Thu 19:48

I'm not asking for you help
JubalEarly Thu 19:48

right but you have something we need in order to not lose
Thu 19:48

so as it stands its like ok we can wait for vamps to kill us all
Operative Thu 19:48

You don't need it tonight?
Thu 19:48

You have a vamp to lynch
JubalEarly Thu 19:48

or do what you say and you might end up telling us
Operative Thu 19:48

So
JubalEarly Thu 19:49

the point is that I doubt we're gonna hear it tomorrow
Operative Thu 19:49

You can't kill two in one day
Fanty Thu 19:49

I have to go
JubalEarly Thu 19:49

we don't need to worry about if you'll keep your word
Operative Thu 19:49

I love the argument that we won't give the info tomorrow before tomorrow has even happened
JubalEarly Thu 19:49

if you tell us the other VM I'll gladly lynch sheriff
Tracey Thu 19:49

if the militia want to kill a mason for us tonight and we lynch sherrif now
Operative Thu 19:49

Like you don't know
JubalEarly Thu 19:49

I'll change my vote right now
Tracey Thu 19:49

then tomorrow we can start killing vamps
Fanty Thu 19:49

All I can say is you guys are literally blackmailing and ransomming info, it's clearly leaving a bad taste in your mouth, and hte people supporting you are very likely to be vamps
JubalEarly Thu 19:49

but right now I have 0 faith based on how its played out
Tracey Thu 19:50

no because then people wont kill masons and we'll lose
Operative Thu 19:50

OK
Tracey Thu 19:50

we have been honest and open all day
Thu 19:50

put all our cards on the table
Thu 19:50

and said it how it is
JubalEarly Thu 19:50

ya except the important one
Operative Thu 19:50

How are we blackmailing people?
Tracey Thu 19:50

trying to negotiate a win for all town factions
JubalEarly Thu 19:50

the one card that we kinda need
Operative Thu 19:50

There is a vamp up for lynch
Thu 19:50

You don't need it right now
JubalEarly Thu 19:50

I just said I'd lynch a mason if you told me
Fanty Thu 19:50

Withholding info until your wishes or threats are fulfilled, at the expense of the village and to the advantage of the vamp
Thu 19:50

vamps
Tracey Thu 19:50

i dont believe that is true
Fanty Thu 19:50

It IS blackmailing
Simon Thu 19:50

Has anything important been said or are people still arguing the same thing?
Tracey Thu 19:51

same thing simon
Operative Thu 19:51

Same thing
JubalEarly Thu 19:51

ok well I don't believe its true that you'll tell us anything tomorrow
Operative Thu 19:51

We aren't holding the info for votes
JubalEarly Thu 19:51

because you literally said you wouldn't
Operative Thu 19:51

We want to ensure we survive the night
Simon Thu 19:51

Any sign of Zoe?
JubalEarly Thu 19:51

once
Thu 19:51

idk if it was when you were here or not
Thu 19:51

she refused to claim though
Simon Thu 19:51

Thanks Jubal
JubalEarly Thu 19:52

how does telling the village who the vamp is not ensure you'll survive?
Thu 19:52

np
Operative Thu 19:52

This is my second ext game and I took a week off after the last one, I think the break after this one will be much longer
Thu 19:52

We don't have any leveridge
Thu 19:52

Masons just eat us with MW
JubalEarly Thu 19:52

the fact that you *need* leverage is the shitty part. I literally just said I'd lynch a mason if you told us
Thu 19:52

and I will
Thu 19:53

but you guys don't trust me because I don't trust you?
Operative Thu 19:53

Well a team wants us all dead so
JubalEarly Thu 19:53

and you want a whole team dead...
Operative Thu 19:53

I don't trust you no
Simon Thu 19:53

Badger still likely to be a silly MW and we should lynch Sheriff to dig and move past all of this bs?
JubalEarly Thu 19:53

do you see the parallel?
Operative Thu 19:53

And I would like to discuss what my team wants to do in private rather than just giving up everything
JubalEarly Thu 19:53

I'd gladly do it if they tell us the other VM
Operative Thu 19:54

I honestly think digging sheriff puts an end to a lot of speculation
Thu 19:54

And they still habe a ML
JubalEarly Thu 19:54

If they're lit then they are definitely recruiting
Thu 19:54

and then even more of the village is at odds with each other
Thu 19:54

if he's vamp, then you guys are safe
Thu 19:54

because there is is 0 masons
Operative Thu 19:54

So we lynch Sheriff to make sure they are lit/ vamps with GD, = profit
JubalEarly Thu 19:54

if he is mason, your play gets us fk'd
Operative Thu 19:55

how?
Thu 19:55

They still have a ML
Thu 19:55

Niska
JubalEarly Thu 19:55

because masons recruit
Thu 19:55

and vamps kill
Thu 19:55

and no one is on the same team anymore
Operative Thu 19:55

Mason recruit is good
Simon Thu 19:55

So we agree we are killing a "mason" today? Good
JubalEarly Thu 19:55

what...
Operative Thu 19:55

It makes sense with gd
JubalEarly Thu 19:55

"we want to kill them all but its good if they recruit so we can kill more villagers"
Operative Thu 19:55

To check the masons are lit
Thu 19:55

I mean for you surely
Thu 19:56

Not sure why you were saying that as a negative from you PoV
JubalEarly Thu 19:56

its not good for me because vamps are just going to destroy us
Operative Thu 19:56

How?
JubalEarly Thu 19:56

lets say there are 2 vamps left
Operative Thu 19:56

You have three sub factions at that point
JubalEarly Thu 19:56

and ml recruits
Operative Thu 19:56

with 3+ members
JubalEarly Thu 19:56

so we have 17 people
Thu 19:56

6 of them are at war with each other
Thu 19:56

so 11 more
Thu 19:57

maybe 5 between vamps and fams? hopefully 4?
Thu 19:57

so we have 6 people at war, inq who still need some people taken care of, like 5 people who are unaffiliated and another 5 who are just evil
Thu 19:57

6 people at war aren't gonna work togther
Operative Thu 19:57

Inq can use purifier
JubalEarly Thu 19:57

they still need each other all dead
Operative Thu 19:57

So people don't die
JubalEarly Thu 19:57

inq isn't as relevant here
Thu 19:57

definitely not the relevant part
Thu 19:58

and ya lets purify the few pr's we have left
Thu 19:58

that definitely helps the case
Operative Thu 19:58

I think it's reasonable to kill Sheriff tonogiht dig him, if he's lit Niska is now ML and has two recruits ready for refresh
JubalEarly Thu 19:58

so 6 people still aren't going to agree on anything because they still want each other dead
Operative Thu 19:58

If he's lying, well there's a vamp
JubalEarly Thu 19:59

if he's lying then you guys don't need to worry
Thu 19:59

but if he's telling the truth, then we're all fk'd
Operative Thu 19:59

Then we will know that tomorrow
Thu 19:59

We aren't fcked
Thu 19:59

There's a new ML
JubalEarly Thu 19:59

I *could* just copy and paste everything I just wrote but w.e.
SheriffBourne Thu 19:59

You don't know if Niska would get 2 recruits anew, you are assuming this.
Operative Thu 19:59

And we already found 2 vamps
JubalEarly Thu 19:59

but did we
Thu 19:59

we have no freaking clue
Operative Thu 19:59

I mean it is a magic new role
JubalEarly Thu 19:59

you may have found a fam
Operative Thu 19:59

Maybe he gets 10
JubalEarly Thu 20:00

and who knows who this mysterious check is
Thu 20:00

clearly one of the people that don't want you guys saying it yet
Thu 20:00

MrU? good chance
Operative Thu 20:00

Or the people most paranoid about it
JubalEarly Thu 20:00

ok is it me?
Thu 20:00

did I recruit shepherd?
Operative Thu 20:00

I'm not saying anything
JubalEarly Thu 20:00

feel free to lmk
Operative Thu 20:00

But the person who it is knows that we know
JubalEarly Thu 20:00

ya just imply
Thu 20:01

ya exactly
Thu 20:01

so they of course don't want you to out them
Thu 20:01

not one of the people yelling at you to just tell us already so we can work together and figure things out
Operative Thu 20:01

Yes, which is why a harlot on our lookout is an amazing way to catch them killing
JubalEarly Thu 20:02

you're asking for a lot
Thu 20:02

you want protection
Thu 20:02

you us to kill villagers
Thu 20:02

like ok
Operative Thu 20:02

I want to catch someone trying to kill a villagr
JubalEarly Thu 20:02

what do we get out of it
Thu 20:02

"we need leverage against you"
Thu 20:02

ya that makes we want to work with you
Thu 20:02

holding leverage against me
Operative Thu 20:02

I want to kill Sheriff and think it's a good idea, I'm not telling anyone they have to do anything
JubalEarly Thu 20:02

do you not see who that creates bad sentiment?
Thu 20:02

how*
Operative Thu 20:03

I'm voting who I want to, what's wrong with that?
JubalEarly Thu 20:03

no one had an issue with who you are voting for
Operative Thu 20:03

Inq haven't revealed their final member I believe
JubalEarly Thu 20:03

people have an issue with you not outting a known evil
Operative Thu 20:03

You and River do
JubalEarly Thu 20:03

ya and inq also don't have a vamp check
Operative Thu 20:04

Like this is going in circles
JubalEarly Thu 20:04

ya
Operative Thu 20:04

You aren't gonna see it from my perspective, I'm not gonna tell you so
JubalEarly Thu 20:04

I see your perspective just fine
Thu 20:04

it feels like you haven't considered mine
Simon Thu 20:04

Considering the 9 votes on Sheriff I think people are on board. If you tell us your vamp you get a 10th and what you want so why not tell?
Operative Thu 20:04

I'm not acting unilaterally for my team
JubalEarly Thu 20:05

Nandi did and she's currently the only member we're inclined to trust
Operative Thu 20:05

So?
JubalEarly Thu 20:05

if we trust you we aren't just gonna say fuck off later
Operative Thu 20:05

I don't think one member of the team makes the decisions for everyone else
Thu 20:05

Sue me
JubalEarly Thu 20:05

but if you feel like you need to hold leverage against us then we don't wanna work with that
Operative Thu 20:05

I would like to know how they feel about this
JubalEarly Thu 20:05

well we know that Tracey doesn't even want to share it tomorrow
Thu 20:06

so lets say I lymch sheriff
Thu 20:06

and hes lit
Operative Thu 20:06

I'm not gonna out information from my team that we haven't talked about first
Simon Thu 20:06

If they agree to tell us today, do you?
JubalEarly Thu 20:06

and there's another mason recruit
Operative Thu 20:06

That isn't fair on them
JubalEarly Thu 20:06

and tracey says we still need leverage until there's one
Thu 20:06

@Simon ysa
Thu 20:06

I just don't trust they'd do it at all if sheriff is lit
Thu 20:06

because too many masons
Thu 20:07

I mean not lynching a probably vm is still ridiculous
Thu 20:07

considering night kills and all
Thu 20:07

but if we know the other I'd Lynch sheriff
Operative Thu 20:07

Tracey doesn't seem to want to out the info yet
JubalEarly Thu 20:07

ya not until there's one mason, she made that clear
Thu 20:07

so if sheriff is lit and there's 3 masons tomorrow
Thu 20:07

how long do we need to wait
Thu 20:07

that's just bs
Thu 20:07

lets keep lynching masons instead of vamps
Thu 20:08

every day until there's one
Thu 20:08

lets see how that works
Thu 20:08

because clearly thats what tracey wants
Thu 20:08

which is the problem
Thu 20:08

that will literally just give the game to the vamps
Operative Thu 20:08

Literally everyone can't wait one night while we talk for the check
Thu 20:08

I don't get it
Thu 20:08

Getting riled up
JubalEarly Thu 20:09

if sheriff is lit, we are in the same position tomorrow
Thu 20:09

so why would anything changed
Thu 20:09

we just have Badger still alive
Thu 20:09

tracey still wanting to kill more masons
Operative Thu 20:09

So why are we still going round in circles over this?
Thu 20:10

Everyone gets to choose their vote
Thu 20:10

You don't hvave to kil lmasons
Thu 20:10

Going over and over the same thing is pointless
JubalEarly Thu 20:10

right, we don't. So instead I need to leave the vm alive?
Thu 20:10

let him kill some more?
Operative Thu 20:11

it's 9 9 I'm sure people will make sure he dies
JubalEarly Thu 20:11

if we balance today we literally just let vamps get free kills at this point
Thu 20:11

what?
Thu 20:11

people will make sure who dies
Operative Thu 20:11

As in, people can move their votes
JubalEarly Thu 20:11

who do you suspect would do that
Operative Thu 20:11

I don't know
JubalEarly Thu 20:12

I can't think of any
Thu 20:12

besides stitch coming on as the savior and making a rational vote
Thu 20:12

like if illu doesn't get their way tonight, what makes you think we'd want to work with you going forward?
Thu 20:12

we can actually progress once we know the evils
Thu 20:12

but you're right
Thu 20:13

it feels like im just going in circles
Thu 20:13

nothing else to say
Thu 20:13

I tried to make my point but I don't think you get it. I don't mean that in a negative way but I see it pretty clearly working in everyone's interest if you guys just worked with us
Thu 20:13

but nothing else to way anymore
Operative Thu 20:14

We were doing that all day, then masons came on and updated their claim AGAIN to include killing all of us
DrCaron Thu 20:14

I will unbalance
Moderator Thu 20:14

DrCaron votes to lynch Stitch
SheriffBourne Thu 20:15

Operative, you must assume that this was the card I was dealt. I don't think I could've done anything correctly in the books of the Illuminati.
Thu 20:15

Withhold info? OMG
Thu 20:15

Share info? OMG
Operative Thu 20:15

Also think I'm not going to be very active tomorrow, spent too much time on this and kinda over it after this
SheriffBourne Thu 20:16

We are enemies, I understand. But that doesn't mean you discredit any course of action I undertake
Operative Thu 20:16

?
Thu 20:17

I'm guessing your mw will eat me tonight
DrCaron Thu 20:18

EXT-296: The Maple Wolf Wars
Operative Thu 20:18

Do it tbh, this rule changing thing isn't really what I signed up for. I don't like playing games where the rules change halfway through with no way for me to verify if they are true or not. Also overbalancing a subfaction with said new rules and discord intervention
Thu 20:18

That's not fun for me
SheriffBourne Thu 20:19

Honestly, I can understand and sympathize with that.
Thu 20:19

Not saying that I like this game's mechanics.
Operative Thu 20:19

It's just a massive kick in the teeth
DrCaron Thu 20:20

@Sheriff: you vouch for Niska, correct?
Operative Thu 20:20

So I'm kinda bummed since I got an interesting role I never had, but I am having horrible flashbacks to why I didn't like the last ext game and stopped playing for a week
Jayne Thu 20:21

Well I voted sherriff - can't do anything else. This game sucks.
SheriffBourne Thu 20:21

Yes, I do, DrCaron.
Operative Thu 20:21

Anyway gg everyone, I'll check and see if I die and vote tomorrow. Don't want to leave mid game but not gonna talk as much, (if I don't get sucked back in)
Thu 20:21

Agreed Jayne
Simon Thu 20:21

Hey Jayne who did you visit last night?
SheriffBourne Thu 20:22

We talked in night chat, so that's a 100% confirmation. He could've been recruited by vamp last night and I wouldn't know, but I won't assume so.
Jayne Thu 20:22

If you are making this shit up you should be banned from playing.
JubalEarly Thu 20:22

that's a stretch
Jayne Thu 20:22

And if you are not, the mods should be fired.
Operative Thu 20:22

Lol
SheriffBourne Thu 20:22

lol
DrCaron Thu 20:22

I'm not buying it and I choose to die on that hill if need be
JubalEarly Thu 20:23

how dare you lie in this game about deception. ban hammer
Jayne Thu 20:23

Why did you vote to support the made up BS then DrC?
SheriffBourne Thu 20:23

Jayne, I hope that - upon rereading my statements - you can appreciate that I did my best to circumvent the whole meta-dimension of the new game mechanics, and tried to present it as something that came from me as as claim, and you shouldn't rely on meta to trust it.
Operative Thu 20:23

Lying about mod things is a bit shitty
SheriffBourne Thu 20:23

Agreed
JubalEarly Thu 20:23

Sheriff did a lot to avoid saying things about discord or mod
Thu 20:23

can't just lump it in with Niska's claim
Jayne Thu 20:24

Well then someone should be banned
SheriffBourne Thu 20:24

Jayne, if you have a problem with mods, take it up with them. You can disagree with their decisions for this game, but being ungrateful for their efforts in general seems misplaced.
Simon Thu 20:24

Jayne please tell we who you visited
Jayne Thu 20:24

I did
Simon Thu 20:24

Oh I missed it
DrCaron Thu 20:24

JubalEarly Thu 20:23 Sheriff did a lot to avoid saying things about discord or mod Thu 20:23 can't just lump it in with Niska's claim
Simon Thu 20:24

Sorry what was it?
DrCaron Thu 20:24

but by vouching for them they are linked
JubalEarly Thu 20:24

ya?
Thu 20:25

was he supposed to let a mason claim die?
Jayne Thu 20:25

JuBal does not use WC
DrCaron Thu 20:25

'mason'
JubalEarly Thu 20:25

I mean they're two different people
Jayne Thu 20:25

okay I am leaving
JubalEarly Thu 20:25

sa far as meta/mod stuff goes, I saw an effort on sheriff's part to avoid it
Simon Thu 20:26

Thank you. I suggest you visit the two WC users
SheriffBourne Thu 20:26

Cheers, Jubal, I appreciate you noticing it :)
DrCaron Thu 20:27

I am going to eat Niska. if they are not dead by morning then my attempt failed and they are a vamp.
JubalEarly Thu 20:27

Ya definitely, it was definitely a great example of how to go about these things if anyone cares to check back later
DrCaron Thu 20:27

I agree, JUbal, Sheriff did not mention any of the Discord stuff; I looked
Thu 20:28

I even told the village that i was unable to locate any mention of it
Thu 20:28

from Sheriff
Thu 20:28

can someone other than the accused tell me who claimed mason first?
JubalEarly Thu 20:28

I don't think Niska's part was bad-intentioned, but could definitely use some work
Thu 20:28

Niska did
DrCaron Thu 20:28

who outed Sheriff?
Niska Thu 20:29

I am sorry for mentioning meta stuff yesterday, but I saw no way to explain that Drunk to villager to mason member with promotion. I did it and I understand that it was bad.
JubalEarly Thu 20:29

he outted himself
DrCaron Thu 20:29

ty Jubal
Thu 20:30

so if i get this correctly; 2 masons are 'lit' and outted, but neither of them died last night?
Simon Thu 20:30

Caron, Jubal care to vote Sheriff so we can have a dig result tomorrow and move past all of this?
DrCaron Thu 20:30

I'll move if its not a balance
Moderator Thu 20:30

DrCaron votes to lynch SheriffBourne
Simon Thu 20:31

Please Jubal?
Thu 20:31

Help us all to move on
JubalEarly Thu 20:32

idk
Thu 20:32

still doesn't feel good
SheriffBourne Thu 20:32

If you're willing to give that a chance, you can also monitor my next recruit. You will know the vampire basement if it is one, and otherwise get confirmation of who the masons are.
JubalEarly Thu 20:32

if he's lit, I don't like where that puts us tomorrow
Simon Thu 20:32

No. It doesn't feel good but we need to know asap
JubalEarly Thu 20:33

if badger is vm we stop an additional nk every night
Simon Thu 20:33

This is the defacto fastest way to find out
JubalEarly Thu 20:33

ya but the messiest
Simon Thu 20:33

But we don't necessarily
JubalEarly Thu 20:33

I just see that leading down a bad road
Thu 20:33

like let's say he's lit
Simon Thu 20:33

He could just pop into a fam
JubalEarly Thu 20:33

do we help either masons or illu tomorrow?
Thu 20:34

if we just end up lynching badger tomorrow night then it feels like its better to do it tonight
Simon Thu 20:34

But then we still don't know if masons are lit
JubalEarly Thu 20:35

I mean if they aren't thats great (because we lynched vamp/fam and have 2 more)
Thu 20:35

but if they are lit that's where I'm worried
Thu 20:35

vamps will likely kill people who don't like the illu so they can get their way tomorrow lynching more masons
Thu 20:35

and badger is loose too
DrCaron Thu 20:36

tbh I don't give a shit about masons v ill v inq. I am chasing stories and claims that do not add up for me
SheriffBourne Thu 20:36

I think there's a way to confirm me, although it's costly and therefore perhaps not ideal.
Simon Thu 20:36

If we lynch Badger he will just regen into one of his fams so it doesn't get rid of the problem
JubalEarly Thu 20:37

it brings us a step closer
SheriffBourne Thu 20:37

I can do a recruit attempt on Inquisition. You can monitor my visit. The next night, the Inquisition member still talks in the Inquisition chat. They are not familiarized.
Thu 20:37

Hence I am not a VM.
Thu 20:37

Just thinking out loud
Simon Thu 20:37

No.
Thu 20:37

Don't risk my family in your turf war.
Moderator Thu 20:37

DrCaron votes to lynch Niska
DrCaron Thu 20:38

Sorry Simon
Simon Thu 20:38

Jubal so does lynching Sheriff
JubalEarly Thu 20:38

if he's evil its great and we feel good about the lynch
Thu 20:38

that part I agree with
Simon Thu 20:38

We need that information asap
JubalEarly Thu 20:39

ok but lets walk through it quickly
Simon Thu 20:39

If he's lit they still have a leader
JubalEarly Thu 20:39

lets say we get info that he's lit
Thu 20:39

and then they recruit
Simon Thu 20:39

Okay
JubalEarly Thu 20:39

and we have 2 deaths tonight from vamps
Thu 20:39

so we are at 17 people. 6 between illu and masons
Thu 20:39

how many of the remaining 11 do you think are likely to be evil?
Simon Thu 20:40

5ish
DrCaron Thu 20:40

Vamp camps count against each other and prevent parity
Simon Thu 20:40

That too
JubalEarly Thu 20:40

I'm not quite worried about parity
Thu 20:41

more that we don't have a great lynch tomorrow
DrCaron Thu 20:41

but you were discussing head counts
Thu 20:41

why does that matter?
Thu 20:41

actions happen over night
JubalEarly Thu 20:41

ya to count how many reasonable votes we can get
Simon Thu 20:41

We will have the vamp that the Illu will tell us
JubalEarly Thu 20:41

Illu has shown they rather lynch masons before vamps
DrCaron Thu 20:41

'lets not act so we have something to do tomorrow'?
Thu 20:41

wit?
Thu 20:41

wut*
JubalEarly Thu 20:41

I didn't say not to act?
Thu 20:42

they also made it clear they don't want to give up their leverage
Thu 20:42

so I would not say we have that vamp
DrCaron Thu 20:42

i question their 'leverage'
JubalEarly Thu 20:43

that it even exists or what
DrCaron Thu 20:43

and IF a team found a vamp and is refusing to reveal it; why wouldn't that just be a huge flag for that vamp to just kill them?
Thu 20:43

seems really dumb
Thu 20:43

from a self preservation persepctive
JubalEarly Thu 20:43

Idk if they thought that far
Simon Thu 20:43

Jubal if we lynch Badger we will have this same debate tomorrow. Lynching Sheriff ends it
JubalEarly Thu 20:43

they just didn't want vamps dead too early
DrCaron Thu 20:43

which is also a dumb thing to say
JubalEarly Thu 20:44

what is
DrCaron Thu 20:44

that they want the vamps alive
JubalEarly Thu 20:44

I mean they've said that
Thu 20:44

that their first priority is masons
Thu 20:44

then vamps
Thu 20:44

they want vamps dead but not until masons are
Thu 20:44

so therefore they want them alive for the time being
DrCaron Thu 20:44

and as a villager i take that as not constructive and I lump them in with the 'vamp' they are protecting
JubalEarly Thu 20:44

so do I
DrCaron Thu 20:45

b/c that puts us all at risk
JubalEarly Thu 20:45

so why would I vote for who they want to kill
DrCaron Thu 20:45

I am not even considering their BS
JubalEarly Thu 20:45

you just think Sheriff is BS?
DrCaron Thu 20:45

I am going after what i think is right; Niska claim is bullshit and Sheriff backs him
Simon Thu 20:45

Yes I do
DrCaron Thu 20:45

village seems to want sheriff dead so i'm good with that and i am eating Niska tonight
Simon Thu 20:46

I'm getting rid of bs claim that happens to be a "mason"
JubalEarly Thu 20:46

ok if sheriff is VM, would he have any recruits left?
Simon Thu 20:46

A "mason" that sounds way too much like a vamp
JubalEarly Thu 20:46

it'd be niska and fanty for sure
Simon Thu 20:46

One theoretically
DrCaron Thu 20:46

the only person i've seen him vouch for is Niska; he could have others
JubalEarly Thu 20:46

would he have had 1 other recruit by now besides those two?
DrCaron Thu 20:46

he may not
Thu 20:47

we don't know
JubalEarly Thu 20:47

I sussed him for vouching for book way back
DrCaron Thu 20:47

VMs should get 3 in this game
JubalEarly Thu 20:47

but apparently coven know who actually recruited book
DrCaron Thu 20:47

i forgot about book
JubalEarly Thu 20:47

oops not coven
Thu 20:47

illu
DrCaron Thu 20:47

wut
JubalEarly Thu 20:47

didn't mean that as a jab
Thu 20:47

but they feel like it to me
Simon Thu 20:47

So we agree Sheriff is sus?
JubalEarly Thu 20:47

(not in the sense that they are actually coven)
Thu 20:47

umm
DrCaron Thu 20:47

I am cautious of hidden coven as well, Jub
Thu 20:48

(not sold, just paranoid)
JubalEarly Thu 20:48

he's not the littest bulb in the bunch
Simon Thu 20:48

Lack of Jayne redirect makes coven very unlikely
DrCaron Thu 20:48

^
Thu 20:48

true
Simon Thu 20:48

Right so let's ignore the subfractions and get rid of a dodgy villager
JubalEarly Thu 20:48

I don't think there's coven, for the record
DrCaron Thu 20:49

the fear of redirect is why i wasn't going to reveal sobering up until i got a chance to deal with Niska, but i was fed up with the BS
Simon Thu 20:49

Me neither Jubal
DrCaron Thu 20:49

noted
JubalEarly Thu 20:49

I mean at this point sheriff is either VM or ML
Thu 20:50

pretty much has to be one of the two
Thu 20:50

due to Fanty today
Simon Thu 20:50

Lynch the dodgy villager? Please?
JubalEarly Thu 20:50

so if you are referring to sheriff, idk if dodgy villager is the right way to think about it
Thu 20:50

and if he's lit and Caron eats niska, and there's 2-3 vamp deaths
Thu 20:50

its not good
Simon Thu 20:51

Yes I am. We are in a shitty situation but that seems to me like a sensible way to get our bearings
JubalEarly Thu 20:51

forcing a vamp to revive honestly doesn't seem bad to me
Thu 20:52

like we coulda work towards their basement at some point
Thu 20:52

gotta*
Thu 20:52

between Badger and Sheriff I'd still rather go for badger
Thu 20:52

but it was close enough that I was being sincere to Op
Simon Thu 20:52

Agreed but with current info we could be achieving that goal by lynching sheriff or badger
DrCaron Thu 20:52

3 MWs is super weird
Thu 20:52

btw
Thu 20:53

Badger, Fanty, and now myself
JubalEarly Thu 20:53

I definitely would have lynched sheriff if they just revealed the vm they found
Thu 20:53

like I'll stay true to my word when I'm good
Thu 20:53

when I'm evil, then anything is fair game
Simon Thu 20:53

Hence I'm thinking Fanty is no longer MW
DrCaron Thu 20:54

so the Sheriff Vamp camp is all-in on the mason thing b/c they know a stalker is wandering about
Thu 20:54

?
Thu 20:54

(b/c of Fanty's recruitment claim today)
Simon Thu 20:54

But I'm thinking Badger may just be a MW who goofed
JubalEarly Thu 20:54

well after the stalk check they had to roll with it, lit or not
Simon Thu 20:54

Yep
DrCaron Thu 20:54

bingo
Thu 20:54

so...
JubalEarly Thu 20:54

which doesn't say much to me
Simon Thu 20:55

So lynch Sheriff
JubalEarly Thu 20:55

thats not the conclusion I come to based off of what I just said
Simon Thu 20:55

Please
JubalEarly Thu 20:55

why do you want it so bad
DrCaron Thu 20:55

WE JUST EXPLAINED IT
Simon Thu 20:56

Because I don't believe their ever-changing claim
JubalEarly Thu 20:56

and I happen to lean towards believing it
Simon Thu 20:56

It keeps morphing to fit the info the village has on them and sounds dodgy af
DrCaron Thu 20:57

Jubal, are you Sheriff's last recruit?
JubalEarly Thu 20:57

when would that have happened lol
Thu 20:57

like what
Simon Thu 20:57

No
Thu 20:57

Can't be
DrCaron Thu 20:57

why not?
Simon Thu 20:57

Timings
DrCaron Thu 20:57

(honest question)
JubalEarly Thu 20:57

cause stalker saw him visit fanty?
Simon Thu 20:57

Doesn't add up
JubalEarly Thu 20:58

didn't you just say that
DrCaron Thu 20:58

there have been 4 nights
JubalEarly Thu 20:58

ok well look back at yesterday
Simon Thu 20:58

If he's telling the truth he was a drunk
JubalEarly Thu 20:58

and see how hard I was trying to Lynch him
Thu 20:58

cause I wanted to lynch Sheriff pretty bad yesterday
Simon Thu 20:58

Please just switch your votes you two
JubalEarly Thu 20:58

idk this seems kinda sus
DrCaron Thu 20:59

i will not be the reason for a balance
JubalEarly Thu 20:59

and I want badger lynched over sheriff
Thu 20:59

so
Simon Thu 20:59

I'm inq I don't care about either side
JubalEarly Thu 20:59

then this is fine
Simon Thu 20:59

I want a village win
DrCaron Thu 20:59

Jubal you are forcing my hand
JubalEarly Thu 20:59

same
Moderator Thu 20:59

A chill wind blows, the warmth of day is at its end...
JubalEarly Thu 20:59

what
Thu 20:59

you just said you don't want balance
DrCaron Thu 20:59

I do not appreciate it and i sus you now
JubalEarly Thu 20:59

what is this even
Lynched Thu 21:00

Badger was lynched by the village
Moderator Fri 09:00

The cockerel stirs...
Killed Fri 09:00

Niska was killed during the night
Killed Fri 09:00

Fanty was killed during the night

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